Boron supplementation

Low testosterone issues, impacts on health & marriage, treatments, etc.
Unfulfilled
Hammock
Posts: 1221
Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2014 3:08 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): September 5th, 1989
Gender: Male

Boron supplementation

Postby Unfulfilled » Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:29 pm

There was another thread that discussed the potential hormone balancing potential for the use of supplementing with Boron. Lots of different effects but two being the balancimg of estogen and testosterone for BOTH men and women.

Supposed to help raise T levels and lower estrogen levels. Study showed after taking for about 8 to 12 weeks. both my DW and I started taking Boron (DW also started DHEA)

I have been On Boron for a few days over a month. I just wanted to report I feel or notice no change. It has only been a month. My Dr was OK with this and agreed to retest my testosterone and estradiol again after 3 months.

Dosing. I took 9mg per day for about 3 weeks and backed down to 6 mg per day since. DW has remained on 9mg per day and I think she is just at 1 month. I have not specifically asked her if she has noticed any difference, but I have not noticed any consistent behavioral changes (like having increased libido). But again one month is not a long time so I really didn’t expect to see or notice any drastic changes in a short period of time.

Has anyone else tried Boron? If so what results have you noticed and how long did it take to recognize any changes?

User avatar
RedMan
Twin size
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Oct 28, 2017 3:49 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 21st, 1981
Gender: Male
Location: Midwest

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby RedMan » Mon Dec 11, 2017 6:07 pm

Interesting. I too saw that thread. I’m on TRT and decided to try Boron. I’ve been on it now for 35 days. I’m taking 2mg per day. At this point, I haven’t noticed anything different. I will have a blood test in about 5 weeks...so, we’ll see at that point if it helps to balance things as I was hoping.

Unfulfilled
Hammock
Posts: 1221
Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2014 3:08 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): September 5th, 1989
Gender: Male

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby Unfulfilled » Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:17 am

Interesting,

the linked medical clinical study from that other thread, all seemed to have a dosage of between 6 and 9 mg/day.

Redman, How long have you been on TRT and what is your dose and how are the results for you so far? What were your levels prior to Starting TRT? What general age range are you and when did you notice the decline in T symptoms ?

User avatar
RedMan
Twin size
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Oct 28, 2017 3:49 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 21st, 1981
Gender: Male
Location: Midwest

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby RedMan » Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:50 pm

I was taking 6mg of boron a day for about two weeks. I didn’t see any results so I lowered to 2mg. Been doing that consistently for several weeks. I’m still experimenting.

I’ve been on TRT for almost one year. 6 months on the cream which brought my T from 172 to 241 in 6 month. My doc wasn’t happy about that so started me on injections in July of this year. My dose is 200mg every 2 weeks. However, I just started 100mg every week. On the cream I felt better but was still having a low sex drive.

I’m in my mid 50s. My systems were varied. No to low sex drive. Depression. Poor outlook on life, no energy. Unable to focus on business. I own a business and four of my six kids work for me. After business hours I had nothing left in the tank. So, the cream helped with most everything except my sex drive was not able to keep up with my wife’s. First time in 36 years of marriage I really couldn’t keep up with her. After the doc put me on the injections...BANG. We started noticing a big difference in about 6 weeks. Like WOW! Starting in mid September we were ML everyday. We still are and we are like 2 kids that just got married only now we know what to do. Haha.

Like I said, I am going to get blood tested in January. But, I think we are on the right track. I am experiencing some DE which is a bit frustrating but we are learning to enjoy our time and thank God for the intimacy. This is something that we missed for the last 5 years or so. So, we are also taking Horny Goat Weed, L-arginine along with our other supplements.

FYI. My wife is post menopause and we are now empty nesters since this past April. That is also a factor in our renewed sex life. So, all in all we’re loving the adventure but working out a few hiccups so to speak.

I hope this answers your questions.

Unfulfilled
Hammock
Posts: 1221
Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2014 3:08 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): September 5th, 1989
Gender: Male

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby Unfulfilled » Wed Dec 13, 2017 7:25 am

Redman,

So are both you AND your DW taking goat weed and Boron etc?

Are you self injecting or go into clinic to get weekly shots?

I am 51 and last test my total T was about 400. I would think closer to 600 would be more “normal”.

Has your intensity or pleasure of tour Orgasm improved? I ask because while I have had no failures to perform, as my T levels dropped, it seems like the intensity of my O, and the volume of ejaculate is less than it was when I was younger and presumably had higher T levels. My thoughts and sex drive are dramatically lower than only a few years ago. But my wife felt I was “oversexed” back then. But then again she has always had little to zero sex drive so ANY drive of my own was “excessive” at least in her mind.

User avatar
RedMan
Twin size
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Oct 28, 2017 3:49 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 21st, 1981
Gender: Male
Location: Midwest

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby RedMan » Wed Dec 13, 2017 9:01 am

UF,

We are both on horny goat weed. She is not taking Boron.

I am self injecting. Actually, my wife does it for me. Haha. As far as my T levels right now...I would be surprised if they are not in the 600 range or higher. Again, I am not going to have my blood work done until January. My doc is aiming for higher than 600. Like 800 plus.

The intensity and the pleasure of my O has definitely improved. However, it takes longer to achieve. My wife likes that. Sometimes, I think it’s because we ML everyday. In fact, my wife told me this morning that we have ML everyday since Sept 17 except for 2 days. But, she added that many days we have ML in the morning and evening. So, there’s that.

Let’s talk about the volume of ejaculate. I notice that mine was thinner and my ejaculations less forceful. [mod edited details] So, I researched and discovered that taking Lecithin really helps. I started taking 5000 mg per day. The capsules are 2500 mg each. So 2 per day. I noticed a difference in about 10 days. Been on it since mid October. The color, consistency, and velocity of my ejaculate have improved greatly. [mod edited details]

I hope this isn’t TMI, but that goes a long way to making me feel more like a man. My wife is really turned on by my performance these last few months. I hope too, that you don’t think I’m bragging. I’m really not. I just want to share with you to encourage you.

My wife was okay back in the day when we ML 2x per week. When we started, in March doing it more often like 3x...then 4x per week, I noticed that the more we ML the more she wanted it. Now the everyday thing is mutual. In fact, 2 or 3 times per week twice a day. Oh how I love the weekends. But, I think her sex drive is up because we have it a lot. Does that make sense?

Unfulfilled
Hammock
Posts: 1221
Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2014 3:08 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): September 5th, 1989
Gender: Male

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby Unfulfilled » Wed Dec 13, 2017 11:08 am

So you think you the volume has more to do sith the Lethicin than the increasing T levels as a eeault of the TRT?

Is the lecithin soy based? I keep reading soy is just not good for a person generally. But there seems to
Be just as much lititure sayimg the exact opposite.

I habe also read something about L-Citrulline being good for men. But for what escapes me at the moment.

ledgemoor
Under the stars
Posts: 3133
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2005 7:31 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): May 3rd, 1982
Gender: Male

Lecithin

Postby ledgemoor » Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:03 am

The most common form of lecithin is soy lecithin.

I don't believe all the bad press soy has gotten lately. My wife's race has been eating it for thousands of years and it hasn't done anyone in yet. Our doctor attended an American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine. Someone presented a study they did showing that soy estrogens have no effect on humans.

Even if that study was wrong, the question that remains is whether the lecithin part of the soybean is the estrogenic part or not. The estrogen in soybeans comes from isoflavones, which I assume is different from lecithin. At any rate, you can't argue with success :-).

You would probably save money by buying loose lecithin granules. A pound (450 grams) costs $13 or so at GNC.

Lecithin is used in bread making as a dough conditioner and preservative. I have almost a full bottle, which I no longer need because I am baking sourdough now, and lecithin doesn't help that. So glad to find a use for it. I'll try it and let ya'll know.

Here's to messy sex!
Everything you ever wanted in life is just outside your comfort zone (Jamie Lee Curtis)

ledgemoor
Under the stars
Posts: 3133
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2005 7:31 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): May 3rd, 1982
Gender: Male

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby ledgemoor » Thu Dec 28, 2017 9:08 pm

I got around to taking my first dose of soy lecithin today. It turns out that 1/2 level tablespoon of GNC granules weigh about 5 grams. Not tightly packed, just scooped out of the bottle.

Will let ya'll know if it has any effect.
Last edited by ledgemoor on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Everything you ever wanted in life is just outside your comfort zone (Jamie Lee Curtis)

Unfulfilled
Hammock
Posts: 1221
Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2014 3:08 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): September 5th, 1989
Gender: Male

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby Unfulfilled » Fri Dec 29, 2017 7:11 am

On the 8th of January I will have been on Boron for 2 months. So far no magic bullet. But I may have noticed waking up at night or early morning with at least 50% erection of “morning wood”. Which I have not noticed recently in the past. So perhaps the Boron is doing something. Or perhaps it is just placebo effect and all in my mind or poor memory of having morning wood.

I will be starting a diet adter the first of the year. One thing on the list to completely avoid is soy. Including any food woth soy lecithin. So I wont be taking it as a supplement. Everything I read about soy os bad for health, except for fermented soy. I know others disagree. The sou in the USA is almost if not totally genetically modified. So comparison to sou in Asian diet I don’t see as relevant. Apples and oranges comparison.

ledgemoor
Under the stars
Posts: 3133
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2005 7:31 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): May 3rd, 1982
Gender: Male

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby ledgemoor » Fri Dec 29, 2017 8:16 am

There is little validity to health articles in mainstream media. A few years back, soy was the darling of the health conscious. And suddenly gluten, starch, grains, fruit sugar, peanuts etc. are bad for you. Things mankind has been thriving on for thousands of years.

You are preaching to the choir on GMO soybeans. However, my comparison to Asians is valid.

China imports 2/3s of the soy it uses, a lot of that from the USA. GMO soy is not strictly a US problem. I don't know this but suspect that the soy they grow is GMO also.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... SKBN1EL1LF

And, a lot Orientals such as my wife live here, so they eat the same [edit] as the rest of us. Just more of it. And they still tend to have lower incidences of breast cancer than the general population.

The bioidentical hormones we take are manufactured from soy. The end product is, well, bioidentical. So what it was made out of is irrelevant. It might be that way with soy lecithin. I'm hoping so :lol:. Things are pretty good for me now, so I don't expect it to do much. But you never know.

BTW, I expected it to taste bad, but it doesn't. Kinda a nutty flavor and not as greasy-tasting as it looks.
Everything you ever wanted in life is just outside your comfort zone (Jamie Lee Curtis)

User avatar
RedMan
Twin size
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Oct 28, 2017 3:49 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 21st, 1981
Gender: Male
Location: Midwest

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby RedMan » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:53 am

I resently switched from a soy lecithin to a sunflower (soy free, non GMO) lecithin. I’m taking 2400 mg per day.

ledgemoor
Under the stars
Posts: 3133
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2005 7:31 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): May 3rd, 1982
Gender: Male

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby ledgemoor » Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:20 pm

CORRECTION! In my last post I stated that 1 tablespoon of soy lecithin granules is 5 grams. That is incorrect. A HALF tablespoon is 5 grams. I will correct my post.

Sorry if anyone OD'd :lol:

Redman, thanks for the info on the sunflower lecithin.
Everything you ever wanted in life is just outside your comfort zone (Jamie Lee Curtis)

User avatar
RedMan
Twin size
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Oct 28, 2017 3:49 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 21st, 1981
Gender: Male
Location: Midwest

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby RedMan » Sun Jan 07, 2018 9:56 am

Here’s an interesting update. I upped my dose of Borop to 6mg per day and was doing fine. I actually was having better erections and the about a week or 10 days ago I ran out of Boron and thought that I would see if there is any difference. First thing I noticed was that I was emotional. Could be that it was the holiday season, but still... I just reordered the Boron and will get back to taking it.

So far though this adventure has been a blast of fun for both my DW and me. We are so thankful to God for this forum. It’s been a great resource and helps us to understand what we are going though.

User avatar
dragracejunkie
Twin size
Posts: 20
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2009 5:41 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 15th, 1993
Gender: Male
Location: Midwest

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby dragracejunkie » Sun Jan 14, 2018 8:27 am

Has anyone tried D aspartic acid as a testosterone booster?

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

User avatar
RedMan
Twin size
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Oct 28, 2017 3:49 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 21st, 1981
Gender: Male
Location: Midwest

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby RedMan » Sun Jan 21, 2018 3:15 pm

Update. My blood test was done last week and total T = 676 up from 171 a tear ago and 248 6 months ago. My Free T is at18. That’s up from 3 a year ago. So, I’m doing much better but not to the goal yet. Estrodiol is at 47.4 up from 33 six months ago. So...the doc did say that she wants me on boron. I had stopped but she wants me to continue at 9 mg per day. She actually sells the boron. So, I was glad about that. I really need to work on lowering that estrogen. She also wants me to take DIM. And she put me on a prescription for Anastrozole. 1/2 tablet per week. That’s 1/2mg. I took the fist dose yesterday as that was injection day. She also upped my Test Cyponate to 75 per week from 100 every other week. I’m concerned about the prescription. Anyone have any thought or concerns or experience with this?

Unfulfilled
Hammock
Posts: 1221
Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2014 3:08 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): September 5th, 1989
Gender: Male

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby Unfulfilled » Thu Feb 15, 2018 10:17 am

Latest two T levels (listed below)

Well I gave a shot to two different supplements. One to help lower cholesterol (Berberine). Dismal failure. Didn’t change a thing. If anything ended up slightly WORSE but mostly within the margin of testing variability. This was fairly expensive at nearly $50/mo so bye-bye Berberine!

Second supplement was Boron to help raise my T levels and lower estrogen. Did three months. 1st month was at 9 mg/day the remaining two months at 6 mg/day. It has also proven to be a total and dismal failure. In fact, ALL of my numbers are worse. Far worse to the effect that it is my lowest level recorded for Total T and highest levels of estradiol since I began testing and keeping track of the various blood levels starting in July 2014.

Also for reference, I just turned 51 in September. I am 5’-7” and 165 lbs and I regularly exercise by swimming three times a week (swimming over 1 mile per session), PLUS I also go to Tea Kwon Do twice a week. My BMI calculates to 25.8 which is considered slightly “overweight” with the cut-off between normal and overweight BMI=25. Despite all the exercise and workouts, I do I do NOT lose any weight. However, if I take a break from working out, I quickly gain weight. I do take Thyroid replacement with a very small dose.

I will give the last two blood labs. The percentage is the percent of the “normal” range.

Blood test on 10/3/17 Just this last fall:
Total Testosterone = 461 (220-813) 59.9%
Free T= 9.33 (5.6-21) 24.2%
SHBG= 34.6 (10-57) 52.3%
Bio-avail= 219 (131-682) 16.0%
DHEA = 256 (62-1,636) 12.4%
Estradiol = 37 (0-56) 66.1%
—————
Blood test date: 2/14/18 – Just yesterday after 3 months of Boron
Total = 370 (220-813) 43.4%
Free T= 7.74 (5.6-21) 13.9%
SHBG= N/A %
Bio-avail= 181 (131-682) 9.1%
DHEA =231 (62-1,636) 10.8%
Estradiol = 41 (0-56) 73.2%
------
So, the use of Boron for three months, results showed my Total T to be LOWERED by nearly 100 points, and my Free T to be LOWERED by 2 points, while my Estradiol INCREASED by 4 points! EVERY number is worse!
I won’t necessarily say that Boron is the complete reason for the decline. But really NOTHING else has changed in my diet or lifestyle over the last 3 months. So, it was either a biologic hormonal decline that kicked in coincidentally, or it was in fact the Boron, or some combination of the two.

This clinical response at least in this sample of one, would indicate complete failure to do what the Boron article stated it would do. The article stated that for men it would RAISE the Testosterone levels and LOWER estrogen. When in fact, in my specific case, it has seemed to have the EXACT OPPOSITE effect.
I am very discouraged. I could eat a better diet and go completely organic etc. But I HIGHLY DOUBT that this would have any chance to raise T levels by the 200+ points I would need to get back to what would be a reasonably healthy T level for a 51-year old man. I would “only” need to lose no more than 10 lbs to get me into the “normal” BMI rage. And while it would certainly be a good thing, and reduced body fat may help with T levels, I doubt it would result in much of anything close to 100’s of points!

I just do not understand why so many men like myself are having low T issues when they have really no other health concerns/issues. There MUST be a cause for an entire population of the USA and the “west” in general to have a population wide decline in T levels of men compared to say 50 years ago! Sure, some percentage of the population may have issues with T levels due to genetics. But genetics have been with us thousands/millions of years. I highly doubt that “all of a sudden” in the last 50 years genetics is the cause of this population wide decrease in T levels of men. There MUST be some other environmental or cultural cause.

User avatar
reillyj
Queen bed
Posts: 181
Joined: Thu Oct 05, 2017 5:53 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 7th, 1981
Gender: Female

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby reillyj » Thu Feb 15, 2018 12:17 pm

Thanks for the interesting update.

Good to know about Berberine, i had considered that supplement (for other reasons) but nixed it..just too many supplements right now.

Refresh my memory, are you on TRT?

Probably MOST of it is simply aging. Like with other hormones, thyroid for example. You can eat well, exercise, take supplements but at the end of the day, if your thyroid isn't working correctly, you will need supplementation (as you know). I know before TRT, my H tried one of the really high priced "Testosterone Boosters" and it did absolutely nothing. Nothing helped until he actually went on HRT both for thyroid and testosterone.

I also think part of it is environmental with all the xeno estrogens, toxins, the like....

Unfulfilled
Hammock
Posts: 1221
Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2014 3:08 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): September 5th, 1989
Gender: Male

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby Unfulfilled » Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:29 pm

I take 50 mcg of T4 thyroid medication. But I take nothing for testosterone.

Dr said because I’m in the normal range the insurance will NOT cover a penny of the cost if I start testosterone replacement. So it woild be 100% out of pocket. The food news is that he is willing to prescribe testosterone replacement and injections are not that expensive.

Yes it is true that testosterone reduces with age. Bit that does not explain why at almost every age group men today have substantially lower testosterone levels than 50 years ago. That is to say that a 50 year old man in 2018 tests well below what a 50 year old did in 1968.

The scale I read once I believe said normal age related decline would have a 40 year old man at at least 600 for total t and a 60 year old woild have aboit 400 total T level. That woild mean a 50 year old would be expected to be at least 500. As seen above, I am only at 370 and have never been over 500 even 4 years ago. And the darn do tors are twlling me I’m “normal” and cant get insurance to help pay? What? I have the T level of a 70 year old man when I’m only 51 and they call that normal????? At this rate, I would have to be dead before they would have a clue I was somewhat sick!

Remwmber my experience also shows that Boron is worthless to possibly make things worse. At least for a man. But it is only a sample of one!

tjw
King bed
Posts: 597
Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2016 3:34 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): April 17th, 2010
Gender: Male

Re: Boron supplementation

Postby tjw » Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:48 am

Unfulfilled wrote:Dr said because I’m in the normal range the insurance will NOT cover a penny of the cost if I start testosterone replacement.


Yep. I got told the same thing last month. I had 338 at age 65. I don't know where in the world this number came from. I haven't been on T in about 3 years and it was in the low 100s. I'm not familiar enough with the kinetics to know if there can be spikes which indicate falsely.

Back in the former years, my insurance wouldn't cover injections or gel, but would pay completely for the surgically-implanted testopel. So I went that route.


Return to “Male Testosterone Issues”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users