Not sure how to talk to husband about this...Back to the same issue again

Can't orgasm, pain during intercourse, etc.
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Not sure how to talk to husband about this...Back to the same issue again

Postby JEM0121 » Mon Oct 23, 2017 8:26 am

Why can't all this stuff just come naturally? :(

Ok, brief backstory. Last July/Aug I finally went to my GP after having problems with anxiety, depression, sleep issues, energy and a whole host of other issues. I had been seeing a therapist for a few months thinking that would help and while I was doing all the "homework" and actually trying to work on things, I seemed "stuck". I decided an anti depressant was going to be something I couldn't avoid, so I made an appt with my GP. Well, after my doctor recommending a wide range of blood work including hormones, thyroid, iron, B12, Vit D along with all the "standard stuff" it turned out I had LOW LOW testosterone less than 12 :shock: My vitamin D was "low" (by my doctors standards anyway-I was on the low end of normal) and the same with the B12. We started on an anti depressant and B and D. I waited a few weeks to start on the testosterone pellets. All of the above has worked amazingly well. I feel like a COMPLETELY different person.

As one would expect, that period of time (maybe 18 months, 2 years) while I was feeling bad was a rough ROUGH time in our marriage. Not just with sex, but the relationship as a whole. DH really didn't understand what was going on with me. He knew what was happening but I don't think he understood the severity of just how bad I felt. And sometimes he wouldn't be very loving or compassionate, which drove me further away

I have always had an easy time having an orgasm. PIV, oral, manual. UNTIL all of the above got out of whack. I simply COULD NOT. Once all of that got under control and I started feeling like ME again, I figured ability to orgasm would return as well. It did not. :( My DESIRE and libido definitely returned, but I couldn't orgasm from anything. I was getting frustrated and I'm sure the more I stressed about it, the more elusive it became. I think during that period DH got "comfortable" in not having to try as hard. I guess why try for very long if I wasn't going to get there right? Our frequency was up to about 3-4 nights per week but I finally told him how hard this was for me feeling "broken". At some point the drought finally ended and I was able to O from oral. But it doesn't happen all the time now. And still has not from PIV since this all started.

We don't have any toys. We have a small battery massager that we used one night during PIV and with clitoral stimulation I was able to O. I can turn off the massager once I'm over the peak and I can continue the orgasm without it. I thought after reading here that that was going to be a great thing for us from now on, and somewhat relieved to know that it wasn't something necessarily wrong with me, but actually quite normal for women. Either to not be able to O from PIV or that things that worked once, don't always continue to work Well, I've realized that it must make hubby feel bad when I have to do that, because the other night I was close and grabbed it and he said" Oh, you're going to use that again." :? And not in the "Oh, wow, that's hot. You're going to use that again" voice. It was more of a "I've been replaced voice" So I've quit using it, and if he doesn't do oral(which isn't a guarantee I will O and he only does oral maybe 1 out of every 7 encounters) or I can't get there fast enough, or he does manual and I can't get there fast enough, I'm out of luck.

The other night we finally ML after a 2 week drought. (Not my choice) And he did oral for about 2 minutes and then manual for 10 or so.. And seemed to be getting too "rough", it didn't hurt, but it just wasn't doing anything for me. So during LMing he O'd pretty quickly and that was it. He showered and we went to bed. The next day I brought it up-and he said "Well, I tried. You just took to long". :( It crushed me. All the insecurities I'd been feeling were just solidified. And by "too long" we're talking all of 15-20 minutes TOTAL. I want to ML more. I am finally FINALLY to a point where I thought we'd get on the same page. My drive is up, I'm working on initiating more and now I feel like there is this issue.

How do I make him see that it's not HIM if I need to use a "toy" or that I need longer. More foreplay, more time. I feel like when I even hint at wanting to talk about this, he gets defensive and says "Well,, I tried" and puts it on me for not getting there fast enough. Which seems to be starting a bad cycle, because next time we start, that's going through my head and I'm not relaxing. I just keep telling myself, you only have X amount of time, hurry up. :(
Last edited by JEM0121 on Thu Feb 22, 2018 7:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby seeking perspective » Mon Oct 23, 2017 9:04 am

Good for you for taking care of yourself and pursuing answers. What anti-depressant are you on? Some (notably Zoloft and other SSRIs) are notorious for negatively affecting sexual response. Talk with your doctor about other options. Wellbutrin is a good fit for many people (including me).

Orgasm has always been elusive for me. I find that more non-sexual touching first (such as caressing legs, arms, back, or neck or a non-sexual massage) helps me be more responsive to sexual touch. Yes, this does take more time--but it reduces how much time I need for sexual stimulation.

My husband has also expressed frustration about the length of time it takes, and he didn't want to talk about it--because he was feeling inadequate as a lover. I told him that I was also frustrated--but I stressed that him expressing the frustration made it even harder for me to relax in a way that made orgasm likely. I said, "Yes, it takes a lot of time--but I'm worth it, and our marriage is worth it. Why am I not worth your time?"

My husband is one of those guys who sees a problem and wants to fix it--so I tried to present it as a problem we had to solve. I presented several options: take more time with me before we start on anything for him, take turns with who gets an orgasm each time we have sex, add in a vibrator to help move things along, or continue working on me after he's had his orgasm. I asked him what other solutions he could think of, and we figured out together what we could try.

I found it helpful to talk about it being an issue with my body and not with me: "My body takes longer to respond" rather than "I take longer to respond." It helped communicate that it was not an issue I could control. I also challenged us both to think past his orgasm. For most of our marriage, when he was done, we were done. I have been learning to say, "Okay, now back to me. I'm not finished yet" or "This isn't working for me, so I'd like us to try that."

Although my husband understands intellectually that my body's response has nothing to do with him, he still seems to feel like it is--so I try to build him up as a lover in other ways. Whether I have to use a vibrator to get there or I don't get there at all, I will stress how aroused I felt or how I really enjoyed the amount of time and attention he gave me.

JEM0121 wrote:Well, I've realized that it must make hubby feel bad when I have to do that, because the other night I was close and grabbed it and he said" Oh, you're going to use that again." :? And not in the "Oh, wow, that's hot. You're going to use that again" voice. It was more of a "I've been replaced voice" So I've quit using it, and if he doesn't do oral(which isn't a guarantee I will O and he only does oral maybe 1 out of every 7 encounters) or I can't get there fast enough, or he does manual and I can't get there fast enough, I'm out of luck.


You might be making some assumptions about what your husband wants. Even if he is feeling that he is inadequate, that doesn't necessarily mean that he is asking you to not use it. Just ask him, "Is it okay with you that I use a vibrator sometimes? I would rather have an orgasm from your hands or mouth, but if that isn't happening, I would still like to have an orgasm while I'm in your arms."
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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby doug-h » Mon Oct 23, 2017 9:17 am

Jem,

I think the best way for you to express things at this point, might be to just share what you wrote here, word for word. I think that it really shows your heart.

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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby JEM0121 » Mon Oct 23, 2017 11:26 am

^^^ I'm not sure how he'd take it, me spilling our sex lives on a message board. :( I guess I could just tell him exactly what I wrote.

seeking perspective wrote:Good for you for taking care of yourself and pursuing answers. What anti-depressant are you on?

I was taking Trintellix only (SSRI), then Trintellix with Wellbutrin and now Wellbutrin. I'm ok with it taking longer since I am FEELING so so so much better this last 14 months. I think DH is a fixer too, and if he doesn't know how to fix something, he just buries his head in the sand I think.

Non sexual touching definitely helps me too. Cuddling on the couch watching TV, or more MENTAL foreplay. Sweet text messages during the day. Innuendo text messages. I tell him how much I like those things.

It is possible I'm assuming what he's thinking. The tone of his voice seemed disappointed I guess. This is all new to me, since before now I never had an issue achieving orgasm. I want to feel close to him and have us feel more intimate when we ML but lately it's made me feel like crying myself to sleep afterward. I lay there praying for courage to bring up the subject and talk to him and to be able to word it so that DH is not hurt or offended. :(

We've been married almost 18 years, sometimes I don't understand why this can't be easier to be on the same page. :(
Last edited by JEM0121 on Tue Oct 24, 2017 6:04 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby doug-h » Mon Oct 23, 2017 12:41 pm

JEM0121 wrote:I'm not sure how he'd take it, me spilling our sex lives on a message board. :( I guess I could just tell him exactly what I wrote.

I understand completely what you are saying there. On the one hand, it is generous of you to consider his feelings on the matter, but on the other hand(I can think of about a few people who are going to come after me for not living up to this completely myself), you are hiding a piece of yourself from him that you both would probably benefit from if you shared it.

What you wrote was not critical, it was seeking guidance and understanding. He might not see that immediately, but would likely get there without too much difficulty. Your words show that you take responsibility for your part in things. I bet he would step up and do the same if he really saw your heart like you shared it there.

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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby ledgemoor » Mon Oct 23, 2017 12:58 pm

^^^ Yeah, you have to do something. This is unacceptable.

The next day I brought it up-and he said "Well, I tried. You just took to long". :( It crushed me. All the insecurities I'd been feeling were just solidified. And by "too long" we're talking all of 15-20 minutes TOTAL.

He lacks basic knowledge about female response. If you could previously orgasm in less than that, then that is exceptional. Not typical at all. Real-life sex isn't like love scenes in movies.

It would be like if he wanted sex three times a week and you only want it once, and expected him to make do with once. Three times is too much bother. How would that make him feel?

And really, why rush it? An orgasm lasts only a moment. And what a glorious moment it is. But don't let that take away from the pleasure of the journey. Pleasure for both of you. He should ENJOY making love to you, regardless of how long it takes.

Has he read the book Sheet Music? Find the section on female response in this or some other book, and read it to him.
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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby JEM0121 » Mon Oct 23, 2017 1:54 pm

Doug-h- I would hope he’d see it that way. I really want this to improve. Now that my hormones are in check and my libido feels “normal” and I’m trying to make amends for all the years I had such a low drive (I suspect my testosterone was probably well on the decline in my 30’s-I’m 44 now) it feels like we’re dealing with a different issue now and it feels like it’s always ME with the issue. :(

Ledgemoor- it actually USED to be pretty easy for me to O within 20 minutes or so. Maybe it’s age that has made it harder or a combo of things.

Wondering why he wanted to rush it was exactly how i was feeling. Usually things that are good tend to be savored.

He has not read Sheet Music. He loves to read but when I ask him to read marriage books, he’s usually not interested. I guess I understand where he might be wondering what’s going on-especially since having an O was always easy for me. If the roles were reversed I would probably wonder what happened myself. The more I worry about this the harder it is to even get CLOSE to an O. I guess that’s why I wanted to deal with this before even more time goes by and things deteriorate.

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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby JEM0121 » Mon Oct 23, 2017 8:07 pm

Well so much for a talk tonight. He got home late from the coaches meeting. So I ate dinner alone. And our us time he promised earlier today which was supposed to involve us going to bed early turned in to going to bed PAST normal times because his dad called, one of the other coaches was texting about scores from practice and then he was on the phone with work. So by the time we got upstairs I could t even let myself get in to it because I knew I didn’t have enough time before he wrapped it up so he could get to sleep. So now he’s sound asleep and I’ve been crying my eyes out. I’m frustrated and I’m hurt. I can’t get ANY OF HIS TIME. To talk or long enough to make it pleasurable for me. :( :(

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Re: RE: Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby seeking perspective » Mon Oct 23, 2017 9:05 pm

I'm sorry you're hurting right now.

It is okay to say, "Sweetie, I deserve to enjoy our marriage bed just as much as you do. How can we make more time so that can happen?" If he doesn't have tome for a conversation, send him an email or text.
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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby doug-h » Mon Oct 23, 2017 9:12 pm

This might seem mean spirited, but if he cant seem to find time to listen, pick a time that you really have time, get him about halfway to an "O", and then stop, say "honey, we need to talk about this, and don't continue until you have reached an understanding. Repeat as necessesary....

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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby JEM0121 » Tue Oct 24, 2017 5:25 am

SP-

That’s what I did last night when I couldn’t sleep. I typed up an email. I didn’t send it last night because I wanted to sleep on it and re-read itntoday to make sure it wasn’t typed out of anger. I am planning on sending before he gets home today so hopefully we can talk BEFORE bed.

Doug-h-

I almost did just that. But not on purpose. I was fighting hard to hold back tears, so it almost all came out during LMing. :(

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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby Unfulfilled » Tue Oct 24, 2017 5:47 am

I still womder if the SSRI drug is not inhibiting your ability to O. Sure your libido is up with testosterone and all. But that doesn’t mean there is a lingering effect from the antidepressant.

I am also a bit confused as to your husband’s response. Knowing how you were able to climax before by his touch and him knowing your medical issues. It would seem to me that he would understand that it is nkt him being inadequate skilled lover.

It does seem like your husband is being selfish both in his time and his attitude.

Another thing is sounds as if your depression may be getting a bit worse perhaps which is further amplifying the dynamic.

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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby JEM0121 » Tue Oct 24, 2017 6:15 am

The only thing that makes me think it’s not the effect of the SSRI is that before we started any of the medical stuff I was unable to O for about 6 months prior. Now granted I had all the imbalances going on as well.

I do feel like lately I’ve been feeling worse-but not all the time. I considered that the depression was increasing but if anything it’s that my testosterone pellet has worn off. (I am getting close to the time frame my other two wore off)But this doesn’t feel the same as when it’s worn off before. That is much more like anxiety. If I took this issue off the table I think I’d feel fine. I mean other aspects of my life are still going ok. Which would probably not be the case if the depression was worsening.

I don’t understand his reaction to this either. I would have thought the fact that my libido is UP would thrill him. Making up for lost time and all. :(

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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby seeking perspective » Tue Oct 24, 2017 6:19 am

Is the change in your libido rather recent?
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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby JEM0121 » Tue Oct 24, 2017 8:24 am

Sp-

Yes-fairly recent. I would say close to a year. It didn’t really increase RIGHT after the testosterone but I think it was more because we were still having issues in other areas.

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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby seeking perspective » Tue Oct 24, 2017 8:33 am

The reason I ask is this: when a wife has avoided sex for many years, a husband with a higher sex drive is likely to feel worn down and hopeless. It may be that he didn't entirely believe your change was real--and he is afraid that these recent troubles are a sign that things are going to go back to the way they were before. On an emotional level, it might be difficult for him to be vulnerable enough to try some new things or take more time when part of him still feels hopeless.

I had been making changes in sex for a year before my husband thought it might be real, and it was another year after that before he really believed it. It took him a long while to sexually trust me again, because he'd been rejected and hurt by me for so long.

It is important for you to press on this. Perhaps thinking about where he is emotionally might give you some insight into his fears and concerns and help you find the words that he will hear best.
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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby JEM0121 » Tue Oct 24, 2017 9:42 am

That has gone through my mind, that maybe it's hurt from the past, and being less "invested" protects him from hurt again. But he seemed more "generous" or willing to do what it took when our frequency was much less. :? :?

Today I keep questioning whether or not I should push this issue or not. I guess I'm losing courage. I DO NOT do well with any sort of confrontation. I just know that in the last few weeks as I've noticed this was not a one time thing, It's become increasingly hard for me to want to send flirty text messages, or to pull out the sexy undies or initiate. I'm still trying but it's disappointing when I pull out sexy undergarments and send innuendos and get my head all in to it only to have him only be able to squeeze in 20 minutes for me and be left hanging at that. :(
This makes me so sad. Our kids are older now (teenagers) and out of the house more with activities, we don't need babysitters anymore, I thought how wonderful that we have more TIME to be spontaneous and not be hurried, and can go on dates more often without having to do as much planning regarding childcare. And instead I feel like I need to make an appointment with him to get any time. His two days off this week (Friday and Sat) are already booked up with other "things".

I have my own things to do, and my own hobbies, so it's not like i'm asking him to entertain me 24/7 and spend all his free time with me. But when I can only get 15-20 min at the end of the day from him for some hurried sex, I'm feeling extremely neglected.

I know I'm just rambling now. :oops:

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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby doug-h » Tue Oct 24, 2017 9:57 am

That isnt rambling. It is a process I regularly find myself in. One thought comes to mind, but it isnt really complete, and might even be misleading all by itself. It can take a while to flesh it out completely, and understand it completely.

It really sounds like your disappointment extends beyond the bedroom.

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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby seeking perspective » Tue Oct 24, 2017 10:06 am

JEM0121 wrote:Today I keep questioning whether or not I should push this issue or not. I guess I'm losing courage. I DO NOT do well with any sort of confrontation.

I don't do confrontation well, either. I approach these kinds of things with my husband as a way of presenting information but not asking him to make a change.

Here's an example: About a year after I'd start to make some changes, it was really late at night and my husband was grumpy. I asked him what was wrong. His response was something along the lines of "Just the usual. I'm [in the mood], but I know you won't want to have sex." In my head and heart, I was screaming, Argh. How can you think that after all the effort I've put into working on sex when you were the one who had a problem with our sex life in the first place? Why is that still "the usual"?

Out loud I said, "I haven't said no to you for over a year now. I understand that your comment reflects how much I hurt you. I know that `no' used to be the usual, but it hasn't been for quite a while now. I expect it will be a while yet before you believe that these changes are real, and that's okay. I just wanted to point out to you that your statement was unfair. I feel like my effort is not being appreciated. I know that is for me to work on, but I just wanted to let you know how I feel."

It isn't particularly eloquent, but basically I laid out what I saw as the problem, acknowledged his feelings, expressed and owned my feelings, and let it go. No confrontation at all, and I didn't ask for an answer of any kind.

I had to do this with lots of situations. I still do sometimes. I make sure I always take responsibility for my own feelings so he has only his own to have to deal with.
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Re: Not sure how to talk to husband about this...

Postby JEM0121 » Tue Oct 24, 2017 10:25 am

doug-h wrote:It really sounds like your disappointment extends beyond the bedroom.

My therapist last year often had me write stuff out for myself. She said we often see things we didn't even know where there as the thoughts start flowing. I do find it very therapeutic.

I think it DOES go beyond the bedroom. I feel like an "extra". Like I have to compete against so many other things for his attention. Like a small child jumping up and down screaming look at me, look at me!

seeking perspective wrote:Here's an example: About a year after I'd start to make some changes, it was really late at night and my husband was grumpy. I asked him what was wrong. His response was something along the lines of "Just the usual. I'm [in the mood], but I know you won't want to have sex." In my head and heart, I was screaming, Argh. How can you think that after all the effort I've put into working on sex when you were the one who had a problem with our sex life in the first place? Why is that still "the usual"?

Oh, I've heard similar things myself. Not as much recently but something along the lines of "Well, I guess that's it for a few weeks." I guess laying out what my hurt is from and not asking for a reply from him is what I should do. Probably through text or email. I just want him to KNOW that I'm hurt. And what he does with it is out of my hands, I can continue to pray that we find a way to see each others side of it.


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