Don't Enjoy Sex

What's supposed to happen on the wedding night? Will it hurt? What if I'm not a virgin? ...
NotYourAverageGuy
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Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby NotYourAverageGuy » Wed Feb 11, 2015 10:54 am

I am not sure if this is the proper forum for this so feel free to move it if it belongs elsewhere. I am 55 and engaged to a 52 yr old woman. We are both divorced and have grown children from our previous marriages. Neither one of us has much in the way of libidos. Mine seemed to be at least partially physical (low-T) but now my testosterone is great. I am on a cream and it has raised my T up to a very good level and kept it there for a year plus now. At first that seemed to help but I quickly lost interest in sex again. My bigger problem though is that I just don't care for sex.

Although I was married for 19 years my ex-wife hated sex and had no use for it beyond getting pregnant. The final 8 years of our marriage were sexless. I stayed a virgin until I married at 30. So really out of say 40 years of being capable of sex I have probably had about 2-3 years of any kind of regular sex and then with a woman who really didn't care for it. So I got used to solo sex. Growing up the child of an alcoholic and having a very dysfunctional first marriage have left me very emotionally flat. I am just not able to experience emotional or physical intimacy. Kissing does nothing for me. It's nothing special. Just two lips rubbing together. Sex became like that too. Sure there was a minute or less or pleasure but the rest of it was nothing special. I get more out of holding hands or hugging than sex. Because the emotional intimacy is lacking it makes the physical far less enjoyable. I also have come to view sex like eating. I am not a foodie. I eat for fuel and little more. So when I am hungry I eat. I don't spend much time on preparing or eating food. It is just fuel. Likewise when my body needs a sexual release I just want to do solo sex, get the relief, and move on. Being with a partner and sharing that would be meaningless and toward the end made it so stressful I could not even climax.

You might think that with time and in a better marriage this would all change but I really don't think so. I've been through counseling including Christian sex counseling. Nothing changes by disdain for sex. Just imagining it in my mind seems animalistic and strange. My fiancee knows all this and doesn't think it will be a problem. I have promised I would be there for her but the truth is I would just be going through the motions. I would try not to let that show but my own body would likely do little. Nothing excites me sexually or arouses me. I've ruled out all the health issues. It's clearly mental.

Would it be fair to marry under these circumstances and is that even a marriage if it ends up sexless? She might think she will be ok with it now but how might she feel over time? I enjoy her companionship and showing non-sexual attention but could go the rest of my life without partner sex and will never be very emotionally intimate.

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby SeekingChange » Wed Feb 11, 2015 11:09 am

My first thought was, why are you marrying? Then I saw your question.
NotYourAverageGuy wrote:Would it be fair to marry under these circumstances and is that even a marriage if it ends up sexless? She might think she will be ok with it now but how might she feel over time? I enjoy her companionship and showing non-sexual attention but could go the rest of my life without partner sex and will never be very emotionally intimate.

So my answer to this question is, "No, it is not fair." Not only is it not fair, it is not what God intended for a marriage to be. My opinion is that it would be best to stay single, maybe you have the gift of celibacy Paul speaks of, and you should embrace it rather than try to hide in a "marriage" and go against God's intention for it and maybe even for you.
God can change what people do, behavioral patterns that have been in play for decades. He can change what we do to cope, find comfort, survive conflict, to count. Rahab had done a same old thing for years...then she did something new.

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby NotYourAverageGuy » Wed Feb 11, 2015 11:14 am

I can't speak for everyone but for most 50+ couples I've spoken to sex is not that big a part of their relationship anymore. That might not be ideal or what God intended but the glue for them is their love for each other and their love of each other's company.If neither one cared about the sex then would that make it less than a marriage? If neither one of you missed it I don't see an issue. The reason to get married would be so you could live together and travel together and be able to share rooms. You would have a marriage just minus the sex.

I should add I don't believe I have the gift of celibacy. Close perhaps but I still have needs at times but prefer to take care of them quickly by myself. Normally that would not be right in a marriage but if your spouse doesn't care then maybe it's ok.

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby mamame » Wed Feb 11, 2015 11:17 am

But you plan to still masturbate?

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby SeekingChange » Wed Feb 11, 2015 11:18 am

There are multiple 50+ people on here, and maybe they are best to address what you've "heard".
God can change what people do, behavioral patterns that have been in play for decades. He can change what we do to cope, find comfort, survive conflict, to count. Rahab had done a same old thing for years...then she did something new.

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby mamame » Wed Feb 11, 2015 11:21 am

NotYourAverageGuy wrote: The reason to get married would be so you could live together and travel together and be able to share rooms.


And this is what she wants out of marriage as well?

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby NotYourAverageGuy » Wed Feb 11, 2015 11:35 am

mamame wrote:But you plan to still masturbate?


As needed yes.

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby NotYourAverageGuy » Wed Feb 11, 2015 11:37 am

SeekingChange wrote:There are multiple 50+ people on here, and maybe they are best to address what you've "heard".


While I welcome their input I would imagine the members of this forum are folks who have a strong interest in the sexual aspect of their marriages. I'm not sure this population of married Christians is a true representative sample of all Christians.

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby NotYourAverageGuy » Wed Feb 11, 2015 11:37 am

mamame wrote:
NotYourAverageGuy wrote: The reason to get married would be so you could live together and travel together and be able to share rooms.


And this is what she wants out of marriage as well?


That is what she is saying yes.

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby SquarePants » Wed Feb 11, 2015 11:39 am

NotYourAverageGuy wrote:I am on a cream and it has raised my T up to a very good level and kept it there for a year plus now. At first that seemed to help but I quickly lost interest in sex again.

Is your doctor monitoring your estrogen levels? Testosterone therapy can often raise estrogen levels. It's common for some men to experience an initial boost in energy and libido when they start treatment, which then goes away when the estrogen levels rise. Do you know whether your estrogen levels are normal?

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby NotYourAverageGuy » Wed Feb 11, 2015 11:58 am

I did have my estrogen level checked and it was normal. My doctor is very good and very thorough. I also have hypothyroidism and adrenal fatigue but everything is being treated and all levels are normal now and have been for quite sometime.

Even if my libido was through the roof that would not change how I feel about sex. I still find it awkward and unrewarding. I know that is not what God intended and I have truly tried to change that. I know God can do anything. However we are talking about marriage. Once you commit to marriage then there is no turning back. If you wait until marriage to have sex then you won't know if things will change over time or not before you marry. Given my feelings about sex and lack of libido I could not in good conscience lead her to believe it will all work out. I also don't think she can truly know how she will react over time. Sharing a bed at night, cuddly, etc, but not having sex might prove to be too much. Of course if she wanted to have sex I would do my best and try not to ruin it for her but the mere fact that we've had to talk about it means she will know I am just doing it for her and probably getting nothing more out of it than trying to please her. I am very willing to do all I can for her but I can't force myself to enjoy it or feel comfortable about it.

Trust me it is not fun being this way. Personally I don't mind as I've never enjoyed sex so you might say I don't know what I am missing. It puts me in a very small minority though and most people have a hard time relating. I'm sure the folks on this site are here in large part because they do enjoy sex and find it richly meaningful not just physically but emotionally as well. They want to learn from others and be an even better lover. For someone though with little or no emotions and no desire for sex it's hard to relate. Perhaps unrelated I have a very high pain threshold and tolerance. Things that should really hurt often only cause me mild discomfort. Things like pain meds do little for me although I rarely need them. I did not drink alcohol at all until I turned 47 and still don't drink much but my body has an odd tolerance for alcohol. I can drink 4 shots of 151 proof rum all at once and barely feel it. I often find I have little sensitivity in my privates. So maybe my body along with my mind are well different!

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby TilWeHaveFaces » Wed Feb 11, 2015 12:19 pm

Pondering this. Our pastor is taking us through I Corinthians in his sermon series right now, and having just finished off the first seven chapters -- which end with principles and admonitions around marriage, sex and singleness -- those thoughts are still reverberating in my mind.

My takeaway, insofar as your situation: Paul says that if you just aren't coping well with being single -- that is, if celibacy causes you to "burn" and be distracted/tempted, you should marry. Otherwise, better to stay single and serve the Lord single-mindedly, rather than worrying about pleasing a wife.

The passage in question:

Bible wrote:6 Now as a concession, not a command, I say this.[a] 7 I wish that all were as I myself am. But each has his own gift from God, one of one kind and one of another.

8 To the unmarried and the widows I say that it is good for them to remain single as I am. 9 But if they cannot exercise self-control, they should marry. For it is better to marry than to burn with passion.

...

25 Now concerning[g] the betrothed,[h] I have no command from the Lord, but I give my judgment as one who by the Lord's mercy is trustworthy. 26 I think that in view of the present[i] distress it is good for a person to remain as he is. 27 Are you bound to a wife? Do not seek to be free. Are you free from a wife? Do not seek a wife. 28 But if you do marry, you have not sinned, and if a betrothed woman[j] marries, she has not sinned. Yet those who marry will have worldly troubles, and I would spare you that.

...

32 I want you to be free from anxieties. The unmarried man is anxious about the things of the Lord, how to please the Lord. 33 But the married man is anxious about worldly things, how to please his wife, 34 and his interests are divided. And the unmarried or betrothed woman is anxious about the things of the Lord, how to be holy in body and spirit. But the married woman is anxious about worldly things, how to please her husband. 35 I say this for your own benefit, not to lay any restraint upon you, but to promote good order and to secure your undivided devotion to the Lord.


Far be it from me to tell another believer how to apply the Bible to his situation, but to me it seems that it may be leading you away from this engagement. What are your thoughts on this teaching?

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby NotYourAverageGuy » Wed Feb 11, 2015 12:45 pm

Good points, TWHF. Trust me I have thought through this same passage. I am close to being able to retire. My fiances children (2) do not currently live nearby but at least one might soon. I have 3 kids from my previous marriage but they won't see me thanks to my ex doing a major brainwashing on them. So I will have lots of time to be involved in ministry whether I am married or not. As it is my fiance gives me a lot of time alone. We do spend time together but I still crave lots of alone time. My ministry will likely be more in the area of writing and teaching. I am not very comfortable in social situations so I shy away from ministries that involve a lot of time around people.

I do keep asking her what she sees in me and gets out of the relationship. I don't think I'm much company.

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby MotoX » Wed Feb 11, 2015 1:16 pm

Ok, I'm a young guy and have a very strong sexual desire so its very hard for me to even relate to this but its peaked my curiosity and I would like to ask a question.

Why do you want to even get married?

You say you like your alone time, you don't care for sex, you will masturbate even if you are married, etc. so why even get married. The point of marriage is to become one flesh, physically, emotionally, spiritually, etc. So if you masturbate but don't have sex, to me, that is severely hurting your (future) wife because if she has any desire for sex, you are putting your needs above hers. If you don't engage in sex in an active manner, that hurts because it shows no interest in her physically. If you don't kiss because its just lips touching, then that can really hurt. If you want more alone time, then that's pushing her away. I just don't understand this.

To me, if my wife masturbated but didn't engage in sex with me, wouldn't kiss me or have any passion, and wanted more alone time then I would be getting VERY nervous. I'm in the refused section here and this could almost describe her actions towards me and I am working my buttocks off to gain physical passion because, to me its very important. But honestly, my wife has her moments she loves sex, she passionately kisses me, she doesn't masturbate, I'm her sole release for sexual activity and she is mine. That is special. That is marriage.

I read this and think that you just need companionship, like a best friend to do things with. So why get married? What if she develops a desire for sex, then will you get a divorce, fight, she have an affair? Why not just stay friends and if she has sexual desires, then she can marry someone who can fulfill them as well as other marital duties.

It just doesn't make sense to me but like I said, I'm not anywhere similar to you so I don't understand but you are in my prayers.

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby poetess » Wed Feb 11, 2015 1:36 pm

If you were both 75 and you weren't masturbating, I'd be inclined to say, "Sure, a marriage of companionship with little sex, if both of you are OK with that, I don't see the problem."

But that isn't the case. You're both young enough that you could be having years of good sex ahead of you. You have turned your sexuality toward yourself in masturbation and you like your alone time. So, no, don't get married. Release her. A lot of women will say, "I can put up with that" when they think they can, because they love a man so much they're willing to tolerate things they really would find intolerable usually . . . or they marry him thinking they can change him. My hunch is she is thinking "a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush--he may be my only chance to get married, so I'd better take my chance while I can." But I think both of you would live to regret it.

Rather than marriage, join a class or a chess club or something else with interests you have; you can be together with other people once or twice a week, but without living with them and without a lifetime covenant commitment to them. Or get a housemate who won't be home much, or a pet.
Marriage--what a wonderful image of Christ's love for His bride!

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby jokerman » Wed Feb 11, 2015 1:49 pm

I'm 51, and I'm not sure what to advise. For one thing, I think you seem to have a good grasp on what sexuality means to you, but trying to know what your wife is feeling is never a certainty. Or that if she says today that "sex isn't a big deal" might not mean she will feel that way in two years; it seems that people are tolerant of all kinds of things pre-marriage, and later they aren't.

I do think it's good that you're being honest about your lack of interest and are probing the implications of that. Most people never bother to ask such questions.

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby NotYourAverageGuy » Wed Feb 11, 2015 1:53 pm

Good points MotoX and I agree. I don't think we really do have grounds for marriage and am trying to get her to see that. I do love her and care deeply for her but I can't offer her a "one flesh" marriage.

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby NotYourAverageGuy » Wed Feb 11, 2015 1:57 pm

poetess wrote: Or get a housemate who won't be home much, or a pet.

I do have two cats. :) I wish my life had been different but no reason to have a phony marriage and make her suffer from my past...

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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby sd595 » Wed Feb 11, 2015 2:06 pm

NotYourAverageGuy wrote:Good points and I agree. I don't think we really do have grounds for marriage and am trying to get her to see that. I do love her and care deeply for her but I can't offer her a "one flesh" marriage.


I have a question and perhaps I've missed it, but WHY don't you want to have sex with her? You imply that you do have enough of a need to MB on occasion.

Is the reason something to do with you? Is the reason something to do with her?

If you both are happy with having sex every 2 weeks then what is the problem with that.
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Re: Don't Enjoy Sex

Postby IM_a_Farmwife » Wed Feb 11, 2015 2:31 pm

I am 53 married to 56 year old. We enjoy physical intimacy and have it almost daily. It is the best thing right here on earth between a married couple. I am to give freely to my DH and him to me. People change through life. OP, are you willing to adapt and line up with God's intention of the marriage bed if your FW decides she wants physical intimacy with you? Are you willing to sacrifice (so to speak) likes Jesus did for the church? Would you stop MBing if your FW asked you to?

This website has shown me many things. One thing that stands out the most is that my DH and I are very fortunate to have the same level of sexual interest. When these levels are mismatched in a marriage, there will be problems, big problems. Who knows in OP's case, she also might be a refuser. It might work. If not, watch out.

You don't marry someone because they make you happy. You marry someone because you want to make them happy. NotYourAverageGuy, where do you stand? Do you care enough to make a change, to line up with what God has in your life as a married person? If I ever became widowed and was in a situation where someone could potentially become a suitor, I would have questions. One of those really important questions about sex drive would come up sooner than later, as uncomfortable and awkward as that may be. I would hate to end up with a mismatch. It's estimated that close to 20% of men have low drives. That would kill me.

When I first met my husband, he asked me all the important questions, so I thought. I would add one more to the list. My advice (for what it's worth...and what you paid for it) don't get married. Perhaps counseling would help you.


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