Shower together first?

What's supposed to happen on the wedding night? Will it hurt? What if I'm not a virgin? ...
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Re: Shower together first?

Postby HisLadybug » Fri Apr 03, 2015 1:36 pm

Isn't this the reason why we tell engaged couples to clearly talk through their expectations prior to the wedding night?

I put way too much pressure on myself since I am a perfectionist and a people pleaser, and I really stressed myself out needlessly. taking quick separate showers is what we did and then proceeded from there. Had my husband pushed or insisted on anything specific, that would have really added to my stress.
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Re: Shower together first?

Postby Ballad » Fri Apr 03, 2015 2:36 pm

Welcome to TMB, Tallis, and congratulations on your upcoming marriage!

Undressing and being naked together for the first time is an amazing moment, but I would encourage you not to think of it as "the most important." It is in actuality such a tiny fragment of your years together.

My wife, almost exactly as SeekingChange described, needed some time to relax first and wanted to shower by herself as part of that. I personally had a fantasy of taking her out of her wedding dress, but she advised against it, saying it probably wouldn't be as thrilling as I thought... and besides that, it would have meant crazy logistics since we started married life with a three-hour drive to the hotel (not recommended).

Because of such a full day, she had told me she wasn't sure she would be up for lovemaking at all on our wedding night, but we did make it work in the end. That was more important to me than having some kind of Hollywood experience with everything "just so."

I think it's great that you look forward to your first night together so enthusiastically. Keep in mind that you do have a lot more time even on the honeymoon to try out many "firsts." They don't all have to be packed into a few hours. :wink:

Talk with your fiancee to come up with a general plan, then (as poetess indicated) be prepared to be flexible.
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Re: Shower together first?

Postby poetess » Fri Apr 03, 2015 3:35 pm

sd595 said,

There is nothing wrong for a new husband to say, this is what I would like, nothing at all, and there is nothing wrong with a new wife aligning herself to his wishes.


This could be misread as, "Take charge, buster, and by golly she had better listen to you so that she knows you are in charge." To me, part of the delight of preparing for my wedding was the combination of knowing I was including things he liked and knowing that the specific details of that would be a surprise. A virgin bride has great vulnerability. Scripture tells a man to deal with his wife in an understanding way--this really is important--as the weaker vessel. If there is ever a time for a husband to do this, it is on their wedding night. If he fails to do so, he might well fracture that weak vessel. (BTW, what hit me wrong in the sentence I quoted above was "aligning herself to his wishes." That could be either "He would like this, and I think I can do it" or "I'd better do it his way, since he insists on it." If it's stated as what he desires rather than what he demands, I have no problem with it. I definitely do think that a man can and should take some leadership, even in the wedding planning. But insisting on how she presents herself to him is not the time.)

Some men don't know how tender and vulnerable a woman's sexuality is. It's more like putting a tulip into a fragile antique crystal vase than it is like planting a 20-foot-tall pine tree. To a man, nudity may be no big deal. But to a woman who has covered her nudity and watched everything she does around men (how she walks, how she talks, etc.) for 20 years or so to suddenly take off her clothes and open her legs is a really, really big deal. Force your way, insist on your way, and it will hurt her physically and emotionally. And trust me that will have ramifications on your marriage bed. A woman has tender, hidden genitals that might not open easily, and even with lots of foreplay and lots of lube, she might suffer pain. Opening herself to you is a really, really big deal. It takes more trust than you can imagine. Violate that trust today and you might never fully get it back. But you can also build on that trust and respect, as my own DH did, in leading in the tenderness and patience and delight of that night.

(rewrote to soften tone)
Last edited by poetess on Sat Apr 04, 2015 7:18 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Shower together first?

Postby YoungSouthernWife » Fri Apr 03, 2015 4:04 pm

The recurring theme in most of the posts on this thread: You need to communicate the expectations and desires you both have BEFORE your wedding night. I'm a planner and we discussed that I wanted my husband to lead our wedding night. He communicated with me what he wanted and I took the steps needed to make that happen. Some people like the idea of "whatever happens, happens." I believe it is very important for your bride to be as comfortable as possible. In order for that to happen, she needs to know expectations so she can be prepared. That will help the night be focused on celebrating your marriage instead of you being disappointed or her feeling too pressured.

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Re: Shower together first?

Postby sd595 » Fri Apr 03, 2015 4:31 pm

YoungSouthernWife wrote:The recurring theme in most of the posts on this thread: You need to communicate the expectations and desires you both have BEFORE your wedding night. I'm a planner and we discussed that I wanted my husband to lead our wedding night. He communicated with me what he wanted and I took the steps needed to make that happen.


This is the best comment in this thread.

poetess wrote:...then you seriously misunderstand servant leadership.


Whoa. You turned "this is what I would like" into "Take charge, buster, and by golly she had better listen to you so that she knows you are in charge," ?!?!?

poetess wrote:Some of you men really don't seem to have any concept how tender and vulnerable a woman's sexuality is.


I agree that it is a time of change and patience, but if she isn't ready she should not get married until she is. I think she should be preparing herself for it in the days before the wedding and be ready at "I do." Maybe it is just me, but after all the waiting, the very last thing a husband wants to do is wait another hour. I don't think that is understanding.
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Re: Shower together first?

Postby poetess » Fri Apr 03, 2015 4:59 pm

. . . if she isn't ready she should not get married until she is. I think she should be preparing herself for it in the days before the wedding and be ready at "I do." Maybe it is just me, but after all the waiting, the very last thing a husband wants to do is wait another hour. I don't think that is understanding.


Again (and I'll bow out of this side conversation after I say this), it all comes down to what you mean. She should not get married until she is ready to have a sexual relationship--agreed. But that doesn't mean she has to be ready, the moment the pastor pronounces them man and wife, for her groom to run down the aisle taking her by the hand so that he can penetrate her within 60 seconds. (Yes, I know you are not saying this. But I'm simply pointing out that "ready for a sexual relationship" still implies a bit of waiting time for actual sex.) Waiting another hour might be "the last thing he wants to do"--but so what? He isn't the only one in this marriage. And if it's what he needs to do, then it is what he needs to do.

We remind men on here all the time that for a woman foreplay might take 30-45 minutes, maybe longer. And we're talking to men who have been married a year, two years, even 10 or 20 or 30 years. All the more on the wedding night! (Likewise, I would say to the bride, don't plan an 8:00 p.m. wedding. You're going to need time to get to know each other, and it's best not to get started on that at midnight!) Yes, she should be mentally planning for the wedding night from at least the time she agrees to be a bride, ideally a bit before that. But that doesn't mean she is being resistant, or immature, or disrespectful, or anything of the sort if she needs two hours of sitting, cuddling, caressing, and kissing before any of her clothes come off. Or if, no matter how much he would like lingerie on the wedding night, she really just can't wear it yet. She isn't broken if it takes her longer to move from "no sexual touch" to "full speed ahead to intercourse" than it takes him, or if she has more steps along the way. (There also is nothing wrong with her if she can't wait to get to their hotel room so she can undress him, if she doesn't even want a shower before they have sex because she needs him so badly, and so forth. But most women need more warming up than that, and that's OK. That can come another night!)
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Re: Shower together first?

Postby padsnd » Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:35 pm

poetess,

I completely understand what you are saying, but I think there is real danger in the other extreme. I know from experience that the "you'll have plenty of time for X later that night, on the honeymoon, etc." is not always true. This is why both need to be explicit with their preferences.
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Re: Shower together first?

Postby InGodsGrace » Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:42 pm

Seriously? I guess some of you men don't have wives who take an hour to get ready? From the time she takes a shower and dries her hair etc it can be an hour.

A woman taking an hour to get a shower and get ready does not mean she is immature, not ready to have sex or will be a refuser. Relax people amd stop assuming.

Having said all that poetess is right on the money!

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Re: Shower together first?

Postby sd595 » Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:56 pm

poetess wrote:But that doesn't mean she is being resistant, or immature, or disrespectful, or anything of the sort if she needs two hours of sitting, cuddling, caressing, and kissing before any of her clothes come off. Or if, no matter how much he would like lingerie on the wedding night, she really just can't wear it yet.


I think we are just going to have to disagree then. I don't think there is any reason a new wife "can't" wear something her new husband would like to see her in, she should want to. People make stuff too complicated and ruin what should be blessing. I think there should be patience, but asking a new husband for two hours of sitting and cuddling before any of her clothes come off?

OP - I pray that your special moment post wedding is a blessing for you and your new wife!
Last edited by sd595 on Fri Apr 03, 2015 6:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Shower together first?

Postby Tallis » Fri Apr 03, 2015 6:18 pm

Thanks everyone for your responses! I liked the discussion. It's important to have debates like this - it's how we learn.

poetess, thank you for the following which you said:

I'm simply pointing out that "ready for a sexual relationship" still implies a bit of waiting time for actual sex.) Waiting another hour might be "the last thing he wants to do"--but so what? He isn't the only one in this marriage. And if it's what he needs to do, then it is what he needs to do.


Your post here reminds me of Paul's exhortation: "husbands, love your wives, as Christ loves the Church." Christ loves his Church with gentleness, so a husband should love his wife with gentleness.

More thoughts on showering together, lingerie, etc: if we don't shower together it would also be super awesome if we undressed each other, then I could watch her prance away into the bathroom, and when's she's done I could close my eyes as she comes out. I shower, then I come out and see her in her glory.

If we shower together I suspect we'll be in there for quite a while :)

EDIT: sd595, thanks! but I'm a guy, haha!

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Re: Shower together first?

Postby sd595 » Fri Apr 03, 2015 6:28 pm

Tallis wrote:EDIT: sd595, thanks! but I'm a guy, haha!


Sorry about that brother, fixed it, ha ha ha :)
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Re: Shower together first?

Postby Learning1 » Fri Apr 03, 2015 6:31 pm

sd595 wrote: People make stuff too complicated and ruin what should be blessing. I think there should be patience, but asking a new husband for two hours of sitting and cuddling before any of her clothes come off?

Count me in on the disagreeing crowd.

I will pose this question ...when you have maintained integrity of the engagement relationship. For example, never cuddled in a horizontal position, and rarely cuddled in a vertical position, physical touch was generally limited to holding hands or walking arm & arm, only shared three passionate kisses (not even th open mouthed French kind), you expect to be fully nude within two hours of arriving in the hotel suite ?

And Nobody is making stuff too complicated. What is being advocated for is "Living with your wife in an understanding way" as found in the Bible. What is being advocated for is being loving toward your wife. Love is Patient, Love is Kind, Love is not demanding or self serving from the Bible.

Poetess is spot on !
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Re: Shower together first?

Postby padsnd » Fri Apr 03, 2015 7:07 pm

I'm very confused as a read back through this thread. The OP question was about whether it would be bad for him to asks about not showing together. Somewhere in the first few replies--even the first one--that morphed into a warning not to push her. So, the consequences of such instruction following that question is some are saying that a DH suggesting an alternative that actually slows things down is pushing.


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Re: Shower together first?

Postby Learning1 » Fri Apr 03, 2015 7:53 pm

padsnd wrote:I'm very confused as a read back through this thread. The OP question was about whether it would be bad for him to asks about not showing together. Somewhere in the first few replies--even the first one--that morphed into a warning not to push her. So, the consequences of such instruction following that question is some are saying that a DH suggesting an alternative that actually slows things down is pushing.
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This thread did take a turn from answering OP's question.

DH & I showered separately. In our case it was his request. Prior to showering we had a wonderful make out session. I was a virgin and he a widower. DH helped me out of my wedding gown then I went into the shower. Prior to the wedding I had asked DH what was his preferred lingerie color / style. He stated that his preference was My Birthday Suit, then he stated to wear what would make me the most comfortable. I choose a simple white silk robe with nothing under it.

My DH was and is an amazingly generous lover. I firmly believe that his care & concern for my sexual pleasure and his ability to empathize is one of the reasons I easily transitioned from virgin to a very sex positive wife.
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Re: Shower together first?

Postby Marriedfire » Fri Apr 03, 2015 8:51 pm

More thoughts on showering together, lingerie, etc: if we don't shower together it would also be super awesome if we undressed each other, then I could watch her prance away into the bathroom, and when's she's done I could close my eyes as she comes out. I shower, then I come out and see her in her glory.


Undressing each other is incredibly exciting and for some men a rite of passage. Closer to your wedding I would suggest asking her how she feels about it. She might prefer to shower on her own first, since she may feel unclean or uncomfortable after the wedding, and not want your first exposure of her to be in that state. In that situation, you could just suggest she get undressed in the bathroom, shower, and meet you in the bedroom.

Definitely make sure she is comfortable, but my point was just that you have to factor what is important to you and make sure you communicate clearly what you want. At least then you'll know if the idea frightens her and you'll have to find the compromise.

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Re: Shower together first?

Postby Ballad » Fri Apr 03, 2015 11:45 pm

It's possible to be very ready and eager to try some big, new activity and very nervous about it at the same time. Sex for a virgin would be hard to top when it comes to such things. But other examples might include starting college or a new job, driving, skydiving, swimming in the deep end...

Sometimes we simply need to wade in slowly if possible.
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Re: Shower together first?

Postby padsnd » Sat Apr 04, 2015 7:33 am

poetess wrote:Some men don't know how tender and vulnerable a woman's sexuality is.


It is my experience that this comment is equally true in reverse, but the reverse more often ignored.


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Re: Shower together first?

Postby poetess » Sat Apr 04, 2015 7:41 am

Well said, Ballad.

BTW, when I was preparing to marry, I read somewhere something along these lines: "What a bride needs to understand is that a groom has spent just as much time dreaming of his wedding night as she has dreaming of her wedding day. In the plans for the wedding day, some wives fail to think about the wedding night at all." It was an excellent warning, and one I took fully into account. To make sure I wasn't guilty of that, I set an early wedding time to make sure we had plenty of energy (we aren't 21 anymore!), I bought my wedding night lingerie the same day I bought my wedding dress (and spent more on the lingerie than I'd ever spent on a dress), and I brought up to him the idea of bathing or showering together on our wedding night and asked him what specific thoughts he had in mind. I also told him I wanted champagne on our wedding night, and part of my reason for wanting that was in case I needed a little help lowering my inhibitions and moving from virgin to a bride.

I was a very sex-positive bride. But wedding-night sex was much more difficult than I expected, and having a tender, patient, gentle man made the difference between it being a bad memory (it could have been) and being a wonderful, loving memory; my respect for him grew that night and the next few days because of how gentle he was with me. I know now that the only reason I didn't end up with full-fledged vaginisumus (sp?) was that my husband was so gentle and patient. (My attempts to stretch myself before our wedding seemed to have backfired a bit, since I didn't understand the need to get aroused first, and I didn't really understand that until reading on here a year or two later.) Both of us benefited greatly from his patience--he stretched me himself over the next couple of weeks, and it really hurt, but he did it with such care that I learned to trust him more in the process.

I did get a PM from someone telling me I spoke too strongly in an earlier post, and might not have come across as what I am, a woman who believes in male leadership and a wife's willing, voluntary submission to that loving leadership. I reread and rewrote that earlier post, and I want to add that I am sorry to anyone it offended.

Padsnd, it's true that a man's sexuality can also be tender and vulnerable. I have a hunch, though, that usually that's more true later in a marriage than on the wedding night. On the wedding night, he's a stallion, and she is a timid young filly.
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Re: Shower together first?

Postby 2pack » Sat Apr 04, 2015 8:00 am

I have wander if our Op is shaking his head as to the way this thread seemed to unfold...


padsnd wrote: poetess wrote:Some men don't know how tender and vulnerable a woman's sexuality is.



It is my experience that this comment is equally true in reverse, but the reverse more often ignored.


I really liked that quote by Poetess. Mostly because that is what I have learned about my DW over the course of the last year or so. My problem was that as I walked through her flower garden trying to pick flowers, I didn't realize the way I went about it trampled the very flowers that I wanted to pick. Thankfully, they are beginning to grow again.

I think if a man goes through his married life looking at intimacy and sex primarily through his own lens, he'll set himself up for frustration. The same goes for a woman. If she chooses to view intimacy and sex primarily through her own lens, she will set herself up for bitterness and heartache. But as men, we generally set the tone. Many women are vulnerable and responsive, as Poetess so eloquently stated, and I have to wonder how often the tone we set as leaders (intentional or unintentional) causes the very problems we don't want to have.
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Shower together first?

Postby padsnd » Sat Apr 04, 2015 8:06 am

Padsnd, it's true that a man's sexuality can also be tender and vulnerable. I have a hunch, though, that usually that's more true later in a marriage than on the wedding night. On the wedding night, he's a stallion, and she is a timid young filly.


Not always. Let's just say we are still working through that first night and honeymoon and beyond years later.


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