Article: Celebrating "Okay" Sex

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Article: Celebrating "Okay" Sex

Postby SeekingChange » Mon Sep 12, 2016 2:23 pm

Celebrating "Okay" Sex
I needed to read this, at this time. I thought there might be others who needs to read from this perspective as well.
God can change what people do, behavioral patterns that have been in play for decades. He can change what we do to cope, find comfort, survive conflict, to count. Rahab had done a same old thing for years...then she did something new.

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Re: "Okay" Sex

Postby The Twit » Mon Sep 12, 2016 2:44 pm

Very well stated. Again we have another food analogy but it is great. How often are we not satisfied with our conditions at the moment. We never savor the little things the just so-so things. We always focus on the big events good or bad.

This makes me think of a friend of mine who had to learn to be content. He had spent years and years searching out churches and other things in the Christian world just to get that high he got when he was first saved. He realized that there will be ups and downs. But one had to be content with where they were to fully appreciate the great gift God gave us. Likewise the best sex my wife an I ever had was our first time. Can we ever get back to that or top it. Not with each other - only if one of us dies and the other remarries will we ever get back to the same high. So it is good to enjoy simple sex just like it is great to enjoy simple things.


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Re: Article: Celebrating "Okay" Sex

Postby OldBear » Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:44 pm

Excellent article and a reminder to appreciate sex in its simplicity and importance to nourish a thriving marriage relationship.

It comes natural for me to compliment Mrs. Oldbear for the way she looks and dresses and for each meal she prepares. It's simple gratefulness and honest delight. If she's wearing jeans and a blouse or dressed to the 'nines' she is always a beautiful sight to behold. If the meal is a simple summer salad and toasted baguette or a multi-course family holiday dinner, how she prepares and presents the meal is a delight. The same is true for sex. Sometimes our sex is a fizzing sparkler and other times it's 'sky rockets in flight' during an afternoon delight. It's all good, and lots of times the sparkler is the best!

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Re: Article: Celebrating "Okay" Sex

Postby jokerman » Mon Sep 12, 2016 5:50 pm

He sets up a straw man and then knocks it down.

Where do we get our expectations that every act of marital sex is supposed to be a candidate for the highlight reel of marital ecstasy?


People who express the desire for something novel might just be the same ones who have contentedly lived through 1200 straight intimacy sessions that fall squarely in the "okay" column. So it probably is not fair to say the average married couple has one partner demanding that "every session" be fireworks and rainbows; it's probably more accurate to say many married people have been waiting 10-20 years for fireworks and now realize they aren't going to get it unless they speak up to their spouse. If that speaking up creates discomfort, well, a good marriage should be able to deal with discomfort and use it for growth.

I think the article is pushing for people to find contentment in their marriages. That's a good thing, but not the only good thing. Growth and self-awareness are also good.

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Re: Article: Celebrating "Okay" Sex

Postby doug-h » Mon Sep 12, 2016 7:52 pm

It's funny. I read the same article this morning, and thought about linking to it for comment, because it really did speak to me.

TMB is a wonderful resource, but I think that sometimes, I might be tempted to be dis-satisfied, just from an almost inevitable desire to want something more (not someone different) than what I am already blessed with. I don't think there is anything inherently wrong with wanting more, wanting different, but if that causes some level of discontent or discord, then I have a problem, and it is not my sex life.

That should not mean that we shouldn't try to make things better, but it certainly means we should always be happy with what we have. I'm pretty sure that is supported in scripture.

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Re: Article: Celebrating "Okay" Sex

Postby tjw » Tue Sep 13, 2016 3:15 am

In our ever present desire to “one up” the world, Christians are fond of exaggerating.


Yes, and it is one of the primary ways in which God's name is taken in vain. People who would never dare utter His name as an
expletive take great delight in being His "salesman".

And, their one-up-man-ship brings utter condemnation to those who receive it, making them believe that they are inferior and substandard if God has not blessed them with their superior intellects.

I have studied and practiced for years to learn Spanish as a second language. It has not been easy, and I am still afar off from fluency, even after decades. I ran into a man in a church I visited who proudly related the story of how God had "given" him a "gift" of a second language. I went away from that conversation feeling utterly stupid and worthless, and castigating myself with why I couldn't seem to develop it even with lots of effort.

Couple days later, I found out. God's "gift" to this man was a marriage into an immigrant, bilingual family 10 years ago. He had the advantage of complete cultural immersion in the language, and was not relegated to books, tapes (yes, showing my age again), etc. He was able to learn his
second language like children learn it.

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Re: Article: Celebrating "Okay" Sex

Postby ghostrider » Tue Sep 13, 2016 8:14 am

Jokerman, you made some good points.

Although he did infer that its good for couples to get away to the penthouse suite every once in a while - it seemed he was mostly pushing back at the idea that "every encounter has to be better than the last". But I agree with you Joker, that this is mostly a strawman. There is a middle ground where we search for that mind blowing encounter once a month or once a week if we are lucky then "celebrate" with half-awake quickies before falling asleep the other nights of the week.

But there is certainly a place for improving, strengthening marriage, and trying to meet each other's needs what ever those may be. And TMB is fairly well balanced in that regard. It takes some effort and that is OK. I really didn't agree with his comment of "And yet marriages survived and thrived."

A LOT of Marriages survived in the 1950s and before because culturally they had to. It was expected. But thriving was much more rare than we think - people were just better actors and didn't air their drama on FB. My wife came across a statistic which stated that alcoholism and/or secret lesbian relationships affected a very high (can't remember the exact number) of married middle class women in the 1950's/60's. This wasn't necessarily my grandparents or your grandparents, but its probably safe to say that our friend's grandparents were a lot more miserable in marriage than anyone realized.

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Re: Article: Celebrating "Okay" Sex

Postby doug-h » Tue Sep 13, 2016 8:56 am

Sorry, I don't buy that.

Great sex is just that. Great sex. I can be a barometer into the weather in the relationship, but it is not the relationship. Many very shallow people in very shallow, temporary relationships probably have better sex than my wife and I do. There are also probably many people who have a less exciting sex life than I do, that likely have more fulfilling marriages.

Marriage is not a thing, or an event, and it's quality shouldn't be measured against some random yardstick. If anything, it is a mountain to climb, and we will never get to the top. That does not mean that we can't, or more importantly shouldn't, enjoy the view from where we are every step of the way. Take it from an old mountaineer. The view from the top is always worth the climb, but if your gaze is fixed too firmly on the summit, you miss the best part of the climb. There are countless magnificent views on the way to the summit.

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Re: Article: Celebrating "Okay" Sex

Postby SeekingChange » Tue Sep 13, 2016 3:22 pm

Circumstances are sometimes beyond one or both parties control. I believe that "okay" sex 4x a week has to be better for the relationship/marriage, then waiting for all to align to have "great" sex twice or once a month, or less. And a burden is lifted to be okay with "okay".
God can change what people do, behavioral patterns that have been in play for decades. He can change what we do to cope, find comfort, survive conflict, to count. Rahab had done a same old thing for years...then she did something new.

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Re: Article: Celebrating "Okay" Sex

Postby padsnd » Tue Sep 13, 2016 4:48 pm

I didn't have as much of an issue with the a actual content than with the title/catch line. In fact that is my issue also with his more popular work: The first thing someone sees uses the shock-value effect to try to get someone to read it. Then, he backs back from the headline.

Why is this bad? Because too many read just the headline or headline and a cursory overview and use it to support bad behavior. For example, the Sacred Marriage tag line has been used by both congregation and leaders to justify the idea that one who hopes for a happy marriage and particularly a generous sex life are not being holy enough.

The shock headline is used far too much today. Regardless of what someone believes, a walk back from such a headline or tag line is not sufficient--the first impression sets the tone and often gives those with bad beliefs a stance to run with.




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Re: Article: Celebrating

Postby doug-h » Wed Sep 14, 2016 6:40 am

padsnd wrote:I didn't have as much of an issue with the a actual content than with the title/catch line. In fact that is my issue also with his more popular work: The first thing someone sees uses the shock-value effect to try to get someone to read it. Then, he backs back from the headline.

I read it quite differently. When I read the Title, it was very much an "Ah Ha moment" for me. It seemed to be little more than a reminder to be thankful for the little things, as well as the big ones. I think the following line is a very good reminder.

normal marriage means many moments of “normal” sex and that’s okay. Healthy couples will take advantage of making certain times special, but what makes these times special and keeps them special is the fact that they are “different” from the norm.

padsnd wrote:Why is this bad? Because too many read just the headline or headline and a cursory overview and use it to support bad behavior. For example, the Sacred Marriage tag line has been used by both congregation and leaders to justify the idea that one who hopes for a happy marriage and particularly a generous sex life are not being holy enough.

Again, it almost feels to me like we were reading two separate articles. I didn't get any sense that was his intent, and I struggle to see where anyone could take that from the article. Yes, there are plenty of people, myself included, that tend to read and absorb that which we want to read and absorb, but that is not the authors fault. I think that the point of view he presented was balanced, and quite honestly, was not written to address struggling marriages, but generally solid marriages. He even included a disclaimer at the bottom of the article to address that.

(P.S. Please do not use this post as an excuse for putting too little time and energy into the sexual relationship, particularly if your spouse already feels cheated in this area. It’s more directed toward evaluating our own personal expectations and bringing them in line with reality.)

padsnd wrote:The shock headline is used far too much today. Regardless of what someone believes, a walk back from such a headline or tag line is not sufficient--the first impression sets the tone and often gives those with bad beliefs a stance to run with.

I don't think that was so much a shock headline as you do, but I will say that how you read it is obviously colored by individual experiences or perceptions. I have to admit that I have only recently started reading his blog, and I don't agree with everything he writes, but I found this article to be a useful reminder to be content and grateful, especially when in a generally good situation.

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Re: Article: Celebrating

Postby padsnd » Wed Sep 14, 2016 5:22 pm

Doug, I think you completely misunderstood my point. As I said, the article and the footnote weren't necessarily bad, but they were irrelevant to the issue I was presenting. Why? Because the title chosen to catch someone's attention was such that a portion of those who would read the title without even bothering to read the whole post would be left with an incorrect concept.

As I indicated, I have heard sermons about the author's "what if God created marriage to make us holy, not happy?" tag line that jumped from that to God made marriage to make us holy and not happy. A responsible writer should know that there will be people who read just the title, the tag lines, or the bolder thought provoking statements in an article and recognize that those should be written such that it is not likely for a substantial group to use that statement by itself to justify something wrong.

If I created a headline that read, "Donkeys make great prophets", to put over an article about Balam; I'm saying something that if taken at face value is not accurate and irresponsible. That example would obviously be seen as a joke and not serious. The topics being discussed in this author's writings are not obvious to everyone, and we know that many within his audience (the church at large) have experienced bad teaching in this area in the past that a reasonable person would read such a thing and say, "Yeah, that could easily be misinterpreted to say something he doesn't mean." His note at the bottom of the article is even proof that he is concerned his words will be taken too far. Sadly, such a warning at the bottom is unlikely to be read by one who would misuse it though.
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Re: Article: Celebrating "Okay" Sex

Postby doug-h » Wed Sep 14, 2016 5:59 pm

I understand your objection to the title. I just didn't read it the same way. For me it was a positive thing.

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Re: Article: Celebrating

Postby ghostrider » Thu Sep 15, 2016 12:40 pm

I agree with your entire post pad. I despise common journalistic practices of today.


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