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On the contrary to your basic position, in my estimation, calling it an addiction can be the wake-up call someone needs. Why do I need to worry about a simple compulsion or “bad little habit”? “It’s just a little sin that hurts nobody...right?”
No, it’s an additive product and activity that can ruin your life. One better get serious about stopping, addressing the issues behind it and recovering.
I don't see anyone suggesting that. I see people acknowledging that you might struggle. Not everyone who drinks a beer becomes an alcoholic, but that fact does nothing to sessen the struggle of those who do. Not everyone who smokes a joint becomes a drug addict, but many do.
The problem I have with your assertion is that it does not address that side of the issue. What do you say to the man or woman who genuinely has a difficult time quitting. What do you tell their spouse? He should be able to quit at will. He must not love you very much. There is a great deal of learning that has not yet happened. I find the matter largely inconclusive, because you do have reputable people on both sides of the argument. I don't know how you can make the claim that porn re-wires your brain in some ways, and totally rule out the possibility that it can be addictive.
I really think you are making your argument based more on feelings or what you want to be true, rather than looking at the facts.
Given I don't think it's an addiction, I agree with you. But I know that's not your point
If by easy you mean I never "slipped" then yes. But I certainly missed it. I'd done it nightly for years.
I suppose it depends on what else comes with that label,
There is a huge and fast growing very lucrative industry doing that. And they, BTW, were the one's pushing for it to be called an addiction in the DMS.
I alluded to that, I am well aware of the danger.
I don't believe I ever said that.
Well the facts say it's not an addiction. It does not work like a substance addiction or a gambling addiction.
I assume you don't disagree that how we label it matters. And what we tell people to expect also matters, doesn't it?
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I don't have an opinion one way or the other about whether porn use should be classified as an addiction. I do wonder if those that consider it an addiction feel that to not classify it as such seems to minimize the difficulty in overcoming it?
I have a son with heroin addiction. He was taught in the many treatments he went through that in addiction "relapse is part of recovery". I believe that teaching was not helpful for him. It seemed to make it more excusable for him to slip. (He wouldn't often repeat that to us when he was relapsing). So I think I understand Paul B's perspective. I, personally, never liked the 12 step recovery strategy of "admitting you are powerless to the addiction" for those in Christ because through the Holy Spirit we are not powerless. I believe the enemy would like us to believe we are powerless so we don't tear down that stronghold.
I have experienced addiction to smoking in the past. Ultimately I had to choose to stop because I wanted something else more than I wanted cigarettes. Maybe I'm naive but I believe whether we call it an addiction, sin, stronghold, or whatever else, it comes down to making the choice to say "no" to self and "yes" to what is better.
I don't want to minimize anyone's pain in dealing with porn or any other habitual sin because the pain and struggle are real.
(My son is doing well in his recovery now and does attend a recovery group at our church.)
When did you start, what were the circumstances?
There is a group called Celebrate Recovery which bills itself as "a Christ centered, 12 step recovery program". I have spent a lot of time with a friend who has been sober for decades. He started in AA, but likes CR much better because it is biblical.
Yes, we are powerless, but IN HIM we are not. You won't get that in a AA.
That is my position for certain. PaulB seems to take the opposite opinion. I think it is totally a difference in perspective and experience.I do wonder if those that consider it an addiction feel that to not classify it as such seems to minimize the difficulty in overcoming it?
Again, that is dependent on the AA program group/leader. I have close friends who have had deeply Biblical AA experiences. The group lead can mold his group as he see fit.Yes, we are powerless, but IN HIM we are not. You won't get that in a AA.
My first viewing was age 6 or 7. It was occasional for years. I learned to masturbate to orgasm at 10, shortly before puberty. Significant porn use stated at 11 to 12. By 13 it was a nightly thing. That lasted 30 months or so before I stopped.
I can certainly understand that. I have friends who have struggled with it for years; I have no doubt it can be very difficult.LBD wrote: ↑Thu Jan 28, 2021 3:51 pmThat is my position for certain. PaulB seems to take the opposite opinion. I think it is totally a difference in perspective and experience.I do wonder if those that consider it an addiction feel that to not classify it as such seems to minimize the difficulty in overcoming it?
Part of this is my personality - calling it an addiction when the best science says it's not bothers me just like calling a dog a fish would bother me. But that is second to seeing how labels can help or hurt recovery.