We tried but failed

Painfull intercourse, pain with sexual activity, and pain that prevents sex or makes sex difficult.
User avatar
Cayenne
Queen bed
Posts: 183
Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2016 4:02 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): June 23rd, 1996
Gender: Female

Re: We tried but failed

Postby Cayenne » Tue Mar 15, 2016 12:16 pm

I don't recommend "blowing up", per se, but methinks your wife wants you to take a firmer hand. Seems like "blowing up" resulted in more progress than you've had in awhile.
"There, but for the grace of God, go I."

User avatar
Job29Man
Pay no attention to the folks behind the curtain.
Pay no attention to the folks behind the curtain.
Posts: 8161
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2006 3:52 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 2nd, 1980
Gender: Male
Location: Hobby Farm, USA

Keep the anger... sin not

Postby Job29Man » Tue Mar 15, 2016 6:42 pm

Keep the anger, because it's loooooonnnnnnngggg past due, but don't blow up (sin not). Let the fire burn in your eyes and tell her you will not tolerate things continuing as they were. Make her uncomfortable. THAT'S long past due too. Whatever you had for breakfast, keep eating THAT every day; apparently it puts steel in your spine. 8)
Wanting to become like Job, as described in the Bible, the book of Job chapter 29. Hence the screen name.

User avatar
The Twit
Blanket on a secluded beach!
Posts: 1891
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 1:13 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 14th, 1993
Gender: Male
Location: Somewhere in the Upper Midwest

Re: Tonight's meeting

Postby The Twit » Wed Mar 16, 2016 6:40 am

At last night's meeting the women did discuss the use of kiefer and some sort of fermented tea (non-alchoholic). The main lady demonstrating how to make the kiefer did share that as she has been using it she has found her menopausal problems have gone away and that she feels 10 years younger (she is mid 50s). So my wife would like to start both. Second last night before falling to sleep she did admit that what she has been experiencing started right after us having sex and that the length of time of having the discomfort is not normal. I did tell her that after this week she needs to go in and get checked out either by her regular doc or an OBGYN.

As for the men's meeting it was more of three men sharing what they are doing to help in the homeschooling. We only had 5 men. We did not talk about the marriage bed. It did not flow into the discussion. I did throw in a couple items for future discussion about how the relationship between the father and mother are very important. But I left it there because I do not think the others are capable of having a frank discussion on this but also the women need to be involved at some level.

When I say they are not ready for this type of discussion is because I do not see them in refusal relationships. Gatekeeper - maybe because many of them have clear ideas of what is right and wrong within the confines of marriage so if Oral is off the table it is because they both have the same conviction that oral is wrong for them.

User avatar
The Twit
Blanket on a secluded beach!
Posts: 1891
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 1:13 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 14th, 1993
Gender: Male
Location: Somewhere in the Upper Midwest

God uses many tools to get us moving

Postby The Twit » Thu Mar 17, 2016 12:40 pm

In a separate post I have explained how things went during our last attempt. The last addition to my post was that I blew up with my wife about the lack of sex we have in our life. Also I complained about her and her doctor not solving her health issues either by delay, an incomplete health history, or other factors. She has responded in helping look for some sort of solution to improve her moisture level in her vagina. In response to that blow up and my sharing it some asked what prompted me.

I shared that I tend to bottle things up do some nice guy things to remind someone that I am hurt, but I allow the hurt to continue and I blow up.

Another thing that has triggered me is I have been reading a lot over the past 10+ years. Each item I read builds me up and help me grow more and more. These things have included the Bible, many books, blogs, this site, and other items. I have meditated and thought of how I need to respond to my wife. Most recently I have been reading No More Christian Nice Guy.

Along with that was a movie we watched recently. Someone sent me a PM with a link to a blog by one of our more famous posters. In the blog there was a mention of this movie. Which ties with what I am reading in NMCNG. The movie is appropriate to bring up today being St. Patrick's Day and he movie took place in 1950s Ireland. That movie was The Quiet Man with two great stars of that time - John Wayne and Maureen O'Hara. My wife an I enjoyed watching the movie one evening recently. It did illicit some discussion and DW asked a few questions one had some issues. DW did somewhat miss the whole discussion on refusal in the movie which is one big point because the refusal almost broke them up. The issue my wife had was that he climax has John Wayne's character drag her through town to confront her brother - either pay her dowry or take her back. While they were going through town the towns folk were encouraging him and a woman even gave him a switch to swat her with. It was that scene that my wife could not understand or comprehend why. I have tried to explain it and I think my blowing up at her did give her an example.

Now I am going to opening it up not so much a talk about my situation but a general talk about are there times where a person needs to lay it on the line and really blow thing up beyond proportion? What are the real consequences of such a blow out? What would the worse thing that happens? Should we as Christian be willing to rock the boat - not only in our marriage but in other aspects of life? These are few questions that have been going through my mind and I have always rocked the boat outside of my marriage but I had to ask why I did not rock the boat in my marriage. I am also looking at what the consequences may be, but I have had enough an decided to shoot both barrels off and challenge my wife at a high level instead of being the Mr. Nice Christian.

User avatar
Cayenne
Queen bed
Posts: 183
Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2016 4:02 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): June 23rd, 1996
Gender: Female

Re: We tried but failed

Postby Cayenne » Thu Mar 17, 2016 3:09 pm

I'm not sure if this exactly approachs your question... But it's the thought I've had as I've read your saga here (I have not read everything, so I apologise if I've missed an important point.)

I don't think blowing up as defined as losing your temper is a good thing, as a Christian my aim is to be in control of myself. However.... Laying things out firmly can definitely be a good thing.

My observation is this. I want to say this delicately, because I mean in no way to imply that any personality of man is any less manly than another. A gentle man is a wonderful thing, I am married to one. There are some special challenges a gentle man faces, in my observation. For some types of women to recognize and respect their man, he must carry himself with a certain level of authority. That may mean that there are times he must step out of his comfort zone and make some firm statements about how things are going to be in his house.

My husband is very kind to me, he is respectful of my opinions. I feel free to express my opinion, even if it challenges his at times. There are times, however, when he makes a statement with a certain tone in his voice, a certain expression on his face, and I do what he says without question or comment. I know that he's made his decision, and at that moment it is my job to respect him. While he discusses lesser issues with me until I am convinced, on truly important issues he tells me how it will be. He doesn't do this very often, so I take it very seriously when he does. (I am far from a doormat personality... I would question him if morality or personal boundaries were involved.)

If my husband blew things out of proportion, and I knew it, he would shortly lose my respect. In my opinion, keep facts factual, because they can be challenged with more facts. With your feelings, though, you can be freer to over emphasize to make a point. Facts are objective, while feelings are subjective.

In my opinion, the reason you experienced the level of success you did when you blew up wasn't because of the loss of temper, it was because she recognized authority in you. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it you who said your father in law was a man who ruled his house firmly? Regardless, I think it is apparent that your wife needs, and probably wants, you to be much firmer about things. My opinion is that she suddenly recognized you as a MAN. She saw authority and conviction. That's what you want. Endless discussion with no fruit undermines that recognition. Learn to speak with authority on important issues, mean it, end any further discussion on the topic unless morality is involved, expect compliance, and I think it is possible that you will begin to have more success.

Short answer, yes, as Christians we should be willing to rock the boat! I believe as Christians we should be willing to stand for the right, though the heavens fall. We practice this in our homes and daily lives, by standing up for what is right on smaller issues.

What's the worst thing that could happen? Other than she ignore you and refuse to fulfill her marital duties? Um, since that's the problem being discussed in the first place.... I don't see much of a downside to you being authoritative (not authoritarian - there's a difference) now and then.

No more Mr. Nice Christian, time for Mr. Strong Christian.

Just the opinion of an opinionated, strong willed wife. Now I will turn the discussion back over to the people who know what they are talking about. :wink:
Last edited by Cayenne on Thu Mar 17, 2016 3:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"There, but for the grace of God, go I."

User avatar
Hiswifeagain
Under the stars
Posts: 3727
Joined: Sun May 12, 2013 8:57 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): June 30th, 1984
Gender: Female
Location: The land of 10,000 lakes and road construction projects

Re: We tried but failed

Postby Hiswifeagain » Thu Mar 17, 2016 3:12 pm

Amen, Cayenne!!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
You will keep in perfect peace those whose minds are steadfast, because they trust in you. Isaiah 26:3

mamame
Pay no attention to the folks behind the curtain.
Pay no attention to the folks behind the curtain.
Posts: 7580
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2005 1:16 pm

Re: We tried but failed

Postby mamame » Thu Mar 17, 2016 6:33 pm

I still think her symptoms sound an awful lot like Interstitial Cystitis.

User avatar
Job29Man
Pay no attention to the folks behind the curtain.
Pay no attention to the folks behind the curtain.
Posts: 8161
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2006 3:52 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 2nd, 1980
Gender: Male
Location: Hobby Farm, USA

Re: We tried but failed

Postby Job29Man » Thu Mar 17, 2016 7:34 pm

Cayenne wrote:No more Mr. Nice Christian, time for Mr. Strong Christian.


Cayenne's post is good stuff.

Twit, You are NOT blowing anything out of proportion. If anything you have not been making a big enough deal of her neglect of you. You have been downplaying it. Now finally you are starting to address it with the seriousness it calls for. Keep it up. She has FINALLY started to pay attention. Keep doing that thing.
Wanting to become like Job, as described in the Bible, the book of Job chapter 29. Hence the screen name.

User avatar
MyWifesMan
Hammock
Posts: 1137
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2010 11:02 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): February 25th, 1989
Gender: Male

Re: We tried but failed

Postby MyWifesMan » Thu Mar 17, 2016 8:05 pm

Yes, Twit, there would appear to be no sensitive-minded, delicate approach, or immense level of patience you have not gone far beyond. When change is expected, or even demanded, the response is rarely going to be pleasant. More likely, often, the response is anger, further entrenchment, and strategies including everything from blame to a variety of excuses. And sometimes, the excuses - as in your DW's case/her physical challenges/pain, have some legitimacy. But the danger is that she'll use that as a force-field to continuing resisting personal change. Her physical issue is already a bit mysterious, if with an actual/definite physical cause. But it can also become a relentless self-fulfilling thing. So much so that she can almost convince herself that she cannot overcome what she "can do little about" - that she doesn't WANT to do anything about. A lot of the behavior you describe seems to thrive without anyone else knowing what is going on - there's no qualified third party - particularly of spiritual wisdom that is holding her personally accountable for progress - unless I missed it in the many posts on this. Seems to me the biggest obstacles are in her own mind, and were a long time in progress to developing. Is there not a chance for qualified counseling? This seems very complex to handle without a competent third party. Yes, your recent assertiveness may have made her realize that you are insisting upon change, but she may also greatly doubt that she can do so substantially, in her own efforts, or motivated by pressure from you.
Last edited by MyWifesMan on Fri Mar 18, 2016 8:46 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Vanna
King bed
Posts: 746
Joined: Wed Jan 06, 2016 4:40 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): May 20th, 1994
Gender: Female
Location: Texas

Re: We tried but failed

Postby Vanna » Thu Mar 17, 2016 11:33 pm

Sometimes we have to say the hard things. Sometimes we've tried everything else- or to the best of our knowledge we have- and the only thing left is to lay all the cards on the table and see what happens. At best, something might change, at worst... We can't imagine it being much worse. That's when there isn't a lot to lose by saying the hard things.

Early in our marriage, when things had reached critical mass for me, I told him I wanted a divorce. We'd been together eight years, two married. Communication was pathetic, resolution was next to nonexistent. I'd reached the point where I couldn't stand anything he did and said anymore. Nothing ever changed no matter how I brought it up. I sure wasn't doing another sixty years like that.

Fortunately, my decision shook up things enough that he decided to really make an effort to change, and I gave it a month to see if we could change it. I'm certain we wouldn't still be married if I hadn't come to that place and he hadn't been willing to do whatever it took.

That said, neither of us were saved then either- so that made circumstances different.

There have also been little moments in our relationship when hubby has felt very strongly about certain issues and has been firm and sharp in his stance. He does it so rarely that when he does I know it's important to him and I pay attention to those issues out of respect for his feelings. Things like questioning his honesty by choosing not to believe something he has said was a fact. Interrupting him when he is trying to make a point. He doesn't get ugly, but he does dig his heels in and get a hard edge when he comes to that place. There is no mistaking it. I do respect that about him. He may seem soft, but there's a backbone in there.

All that to say- it's clear from your posts that you are sensitive and considerate and giving, you've gone above and beyond in so many ways. This new firmness seems to have made her pause, and I pray this moment turns into a full blown breakthrough for you both.
After 28 years and six kids, through the good and bad, by the grace of God, things keep getting better and better. ::wed

User avatar
FoxluvsBunnyDFC
King bed
Posts: 566
Joined: Tue Jul 21, 2015 3:36 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): May 23rd, 2015
Gender: Female
Location: Northeast USA

Re: We tried but failed

Postby FoxluvsBunnyDFC » Fri Mar 18, 2016 12:19 pm

mamame wrote:I still think her symptoms sound an awful lot like Interstitial Cystitis.


I am so sorry Twit for the situation. I have skimmed some of your posts, so I'm sure i missed some details. I really wish we could hear Mrs. Twit's perspective. There is a chance that she might have a legit medical condition such as what mamame suggested above leaving her in pain all the time. I've heard of IC and I do know it can be exacerbated by sex or orgasm. Twit, please do continue to be firm. Your wife should (even if she is in pain) be making efforts to find out what is wrong medically. At the same time, maybe you can take the lead (if she'd be willing) to try to help her find the correct practioner (perhaps someone more holistic would be appropriate hear as I know such conditions can be improved w/ diet).

The Twit wrote:Side question related to my issue. How much affect does HBC pill have on prolonging or delaying the onset of menopause? How about leading to the vaginal atrophy as shared earlier?

I ask because I am studying many things about hormones and their affect on different aspects in ones body. I am concerned that the HBC did control her erratic cycles what other things did they damage.


And no, HBC does not delay the onset of menopause from my understanding. From my understanding, it can mask the symptoms as it contains (synthetic) hormones. so even if a woman's body would no longer be able to stimulate eggs and have a normal cycle, it can mimic the regular bleed because the pill contains hormones and then the withdrawal from them causes what seems like a regularly timed period (much like a less natural form of HRT); but that's not a cycle where her body is ovulating and making the hormones. So i would think that in order to know if menopause has occurred a woman would need to go off of those hormones. I'm a bit confused as to your question and if you are asking if the pill or menopause potentially caused her issue. I'm sure menopause could cause some lowered desire and dryness, but I have also heard that it can take some time to reawaken libido after being extensively on the pill (not sure if this is the case w/ your wife). I'm sure that if she was on the pill around perimenopause and then went off and realized that she was in menopause, she's facing a double whammy hormonally. I really think, though, that if this is part of the issue, now that she is off, it can still be reversed. Maybe not as much as a woman who is pre-menopausal, so those hormones that were being made dormant by the pill are being manufactured in high amounts again, but I think that things will resolve a bit after she's been off a while. I would suggest looking into a doctor who knows about vitamins, herbs, and bio-identical hormones. This might help with the hormonal piece, but I really think w/ all the burning something else is going on (whether a major emotional and/or major health issue) and I really don't want to minimize Mrs. Twit here, who may be suffering. I wish she'd take initiative with finding things out because sex is important to her. If I had an issue where every time fox and i had sex it was excruciating, i'd be constantly researching and trying new things to try to improve the situation.

Blessings!
<3, Bunny
Just a Bunny learning everyday what it means to Love and Live Harmoniously with a Fox

But if you tame me then we shall need each other. To me, you will be unique in all the world. To you, I shall be unique in all the world.~TLP

User avatar
Vanna
King bed
Posts: 746
Joined: Wed Jan 06, 2016 4:40 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): May 20th, 1994
Gender: Female
Location: Texas

Re: We tried but failed

Postby Vanna » Fri Mar 18, 2016 12:36 pm

Ditto what Bunny said.

I did think of your wife the other night when "things" were burning from those jalapeños... Wondering if that was anything like what she experiences, cause that's no fun for sure. If that happened all the time, I'd sure want a solution myself.
After 28 years and six kids, through the good and bad, by the grace of God, things keep getting better and better. ::wed

User avatar
The Twit
Blanket on a secluded beach!
Posts: 1891
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 1:13 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 14th, 1993
Gender: Male
Location: Somewhere in the Upper Midwest

Re: We tried but failed

Postby The Twit » Fri Mar 18, 2016 12:40 pm

mamame wrote:I still think her symptoms sound an awful lot like Interstitial Cystitis.

How could I have missed this. I talked a bit last night with my wife before falling to sleep. This is what her doctor had concluded last year but there was no follow-up and no work on my wife's part. I looked it up but did not read it completely on Mayo or WebMD. I will research it more. I also told DW that this weekend we will punch in all of her symptoms so she can go to the doc with potential ideas and potential solutions.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

User avatar
FoxluvsBunnyDFC
King bed
Posts: 566
Joined: Tue Jul 21, 2015 3:36 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): May 23rd, 2015
Gender: Female
Location: Northeast USA

Re: We tried but failed

Postby FoxluvsBunnyDFC » Fri Mar 18, 2016 2:19 pm

glad you are looking into this... did a quick google search and apparently IC can be exacerbated by hormonal changes (i.e.: cycle, menopause), and it sounds like your wife has had quite a few of those. Something to consider. Praying you find answers and she is motivated to help with the search and take initiative.
<3, Bunny
Just a Bunny learning everyday what it means to Love and Live Harmoniously with a Fox

But if you tame me then we shall need each other. To me, you will be unique in all the world. To you, I shall be unique in all the world.~TLP

neilethere
California King
Posts: 775
Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2009 5:27 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): March 18th, 2000
Gender: Male
Location: The land down under ...... where women glow and men ppplllllunder

Re: We tried but failed

Postby neilethere » Fri Mar 18, 2016 8:10 pm

Twit,

It has been discussed before but now you are wearing your man boots it might be time to insist on seeing the Doctor with her.

User avatar
Job29Man
Pay no attention to the folks behind the curtain.
Pay no attention to the folks behind the curtain.
Posts: 8161
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2006 3:52 pm
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 2nd, 1980
Gender: Male
Location: Hobby Farm, USA

TT gets to go into the exam and doctor meeting

Postby Job29Man » Sat Mar 19, 2016 7:26 am

Neil, good advice...I agree. This business of "I'll visit the doctor alone, ask him the questions I want to ask alone, and if I choose not to ask I won't ask, and if I get an answer that I don't like... I may or may not tell you." That's baloney. She does that to avoid the truth and to control the situation. It is passive aggressive. Twit has every right to insist...

"I AM going into the next appointment with you, into the exam room, and you will tell the doctor to speak freely with me about EVERYTHING, and I will be able to question the doctor about ANYTHING and insist on direct answers while you are sitting there listening and participating."
Wanting to become like Job, as described in the Bible, the book of Job chapter 29. Hence the screen name.

User avatar
The Twit
Blanket on a secluded beach!
Posts: 1891
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 1:13 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 14th, 1993
Gender: Male
Location: Somewhere in the Upper Midwest

Re: We tried but failed

Postby The Twit » Wed Mar 23, 2016 8:58 am

I am getting encouraged about some of the issues. Mrs. Twit has sat down with me in bed before we go to sleep and I brought up the Mayo Clinic information about IC. I also shared with her a couple of sites just for those with IC. In addition I shared that I want to review what she is going to talk with the Doctor during her next visit.

She does have a follow up MRI and other tests. She will be following up with her personal doctor about the results of the tests, the IC issue, and other issues that have come up more recently with her brother, and others in her family involving cysts on the kidneys and how this is a genetic issue. So she will be following up with him on those items. She did have issues with cysts on her ovaries since the birth of our second child. So she is concerned that she may have similar issues as her brother. I keep my iPad and my tablet/netbook PC by my bed and we can look up items before we go to sleep.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

User avatar
The Twit
Blanket on a secluded beach!
Posts: 1891
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 1:13 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 14th, 1993
Gender: Male
Location: Somewhere in the Upper Midwest

We tried but failed

Postby The Twit » Tue Mar 29, 2016 8:08 pm

Just a quick prayer request or two. First my wife has her follow-up MRI tomorrow. Pray that if there is something they can do something or if there is nothing then l t there be a doctor who can figure out what is going on with her. Second pray for me. I have been down for a few days fighting some sort of cold or other virus. On Sunday, after church we went out to my in laws and I ended up going into another room to rest because of a bad headache that caused me to have an upset stomache. I went to work yesterday, big mistake fell asleep all of the time. When I get sick I sleep a lot.

Also if you all want to lift up my BIL he has been having problems and is on his second family leave. The doctors he has seen are stumped on what is causing issues.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

User avatar
George B.
On the floor
Posts: 1654
Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2005 2:12 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): July 20th, 1996
Gender: Male
Location: Further up and further in

Re: We tried but failed

Postby George B. » Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:35 pm

any updates on the situation, Twit?
On sex: "Neither men nor women will be asked to throw away the weapon they have used victoriously. It is the beaten and the fugitives who throw away their swords. The conquerors sheathe theirs and retain them."-C.S. Lewis

User avatar
The Twit
Blanket on a secluded beach!
Posts: 1891
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 1:13 am
Date of your marriage (past or future): August 14th, 1993
Gender: Male
Location: Somewhere in the Upper Midwest

Re: We tried but failed

Postby The Twit » Thu Apr 07, 2016 6:38 am

Thanks for asking George. We have not heard from the MRI. Probable will hear later when she has a meeting with the Doctor.

As for my BIL just keep praying for him. The doctors cannot seem to figure out what is wrong with him. Nor are they willing to allow him to do one treatment that he got some relief. I say they won't let him because the one treatment is prednisone and similar to the testosterone clamp down they have clamped down on prednisone.

A new big thing happened and that was my 96 year old grandmother died this past week. I am working one getting us all out for her funeral in a couple weeks.

Other than that nothing has happened in the bed room. Colds being passed around and we both have had some stomach bug. So nothing has happened. She still has some discharge but the pain/ burning has done away.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Return to “Pain during or preventing sex”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users