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Compare & contrasting list of "healthy vs unhealthy" sex

Self image, being intentional, sexual awakening, nudity, modesty limits, likes/dislikes, sex language
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benny
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Re: Compare & contrasting list of "healthy vs unhealthy" sex

Post by benny »

Personally I'm in the camp believing that as a spouse I do have an obligation to meet the needs both sexually and physical of my spouse if I'm physically able. In our vows we promised to "have and to hold". If course there's always circumstances that might delay that promise but only for a reasonable time. I also believe that a sexless marriage is a breech of that marriage contract and a sin. Duty sex can fall into that category and it probably should but it's so much better if both parties eagerly desire it. This may not be a popular opinion these days but if you disagree I'm open to hear your position. I just want to add I do not support rape or abuse of a spouse, that is wrong!!

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newwifenewlife
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Re: Compare & contrasting list of "healthy vs unhealthy" sex

Post by newwifenewlife »

LBD wrote: Mon Oct 11, 2021 1:41 pm much too simplistic and casts way too wide of a net across "unhealthy" to be useful as it is now IMO. Could it start a discussion? Maybe - or a fight. The "obligation" point is just one, if not the most glaring example.

But if you're just looking for a list of things to start talking about - then I guess it could have some use. But that is not how it seems to be presented. It seems to say "these good, these bad" with no room for subjectivity or nuance.
If you're referring to how I presented it as a list, I just showed it and posed the question "What stands out?". The author said in the article that "Learning how to distinguish healthy sex from other forms of sex can empower you to bring Healthy Sex more into your own life." That seems like a healthy place to start asking questions about one's relationship and what may or may not be healthy (emotionally, physically, spiritually) and what other thoughts might need to be considered in the discussion or how to interpret each contrast. Certainly, we as Christians might have some thoughts or Scriptures to carefully consider.
I think the premise is misleading for your purposes. It seems to be built for persons (women particularly) who may be in addictive or abusive relationships. They probably need to look at things a bit differently than those in non-abusive, non-addicted relationships. I don't think one wants to put all marriages, under all circumstances, in this box. So I would ultimately say context is the issue.
While I will admit that many times, we think of women submitting themselves and participating in unhealthy relationships and sex. And yes, women do need to look at things a bit different because of being more physically vulnerable among other things. But I will also submit that there are quite a few men, even those who are participating on TMB (or who have in the past), and certainly many more who are in the shadows, who are having and even encouraging or insisting on "unhealthy" sex in their marriage through their anger, unkind acts, and selfishness, just to name a few things. Therefore, it seems to me that there's value in the asking and discussion about "what [point(s)] stands out"? Maybe someone might actually reflect to ask, "How am I contributing to the problem and situation?" (And I have definitely posed that question in several ways in the past few months.)
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SLS
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Re: Compare & contrasting list of "healthy vs unhealthy" sex

Post by SLS »

David wrote: Mon Oct 11, 2021 1:16 pmAs an example, we've discussed above the concept of "sex as an obligation". That's a concept that could helpfully be explored and expanded upon to think about where does this become an unhelpful thing and how can we address it?
I think you hit the nail on the head in your previous post.
David wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 8:19 am I think the sex as an obligation thing might be about the freedom to say no.
What you seem to be describing is a situation where one partner chooses to say yes to sex in order to be faithful to their promises, rather than being coerced into sex.
Sometimes it's healthy to have "duty" sex, but it's unhealthy to feel that you can't ever say no to sex.
A good scriptural parallel is that of tithing. 2 Corinthians 9:6-7 (ESV) states:
Bible:
The point is this: whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows bountifully will also reap bountifully. Each one must give as he has decided in his heart, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.
Compulsion (i.e., not being able to say no) has no place in tithing or in the marriage bed. Not only is compulsion morally wrong but it defeats the ultimate purpose, which is honoring/trusting God in tithing and connecting with your spouse in sex.

Verse 6 though points out the opposite problem. If a spouse is intentionally avoiding intimacy with their lover both of them are adversely effected. So to sum it up don't have sex because "its your duty". Have sex because it benefits your spouse, yourself, and your marriage.

Now of course there are times when either spouse "isn't feeling it". I didn't particularly desire to watch a 3 hour Disney movie with my wife Friday night, especially as it took away the opportunity for sex. But watching that movie was important to her as it was a favorite of her childhood and she wanted me to see it and share in her delight.

So I did and I really enjoyed my time with her, so much so that it didn't bother me that sex was off the table because of it.
Happily married to Serafina for 7 years. She is my Venus. ::luv2
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SLS
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Re: Compare & contrasting list of "healthy vs unhealthy" sex

Post by SLS »

SeekingChange wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 7:28 amA healthy human being has a variety of emotions, beyond "liking" and "enthusiasm", or just "angry" for some, and to learn to live life in the midst of them and through the processing of them, is healthy. Jesus, with His suffering and crucifixion, is a perfect example....He, "who for the joy set before Him endured the cross..." I am pretty sure there wasn't smiles and enthusiasm in the process....so, is that proof He really didn't love us, like us, or desire a relationship with us? <tongue in cheek>
If somebody feels having sex with their spouse is equivalent to going to the cross I would encourage them to seek some kind of help for the issue immediately as that is not what sex should feel like.

A better analogy would be Jesus with the crowds and the apostles. He spent a lot of time teaching, nurturing, and healing the crowds of people who came to Him. There were times where he was enthusiastic and there were times where he was feeling down (e.g., death of John the Baptist). When He needed to He took time away from His disciples and the crowds and spent time alone with God.

Nobody should be expecting a lower drive spouse to be constantly up for bed-breaking enthusiastic sex. Spouses need to work together to balance things so that the LD spouse is not overwhelmed and the HD spouse isn't feeling neglected.

It should be understood that its okay for a LD spouse to just "lay there" or "hold the vibe" if that is all they can do at the moment. If that is all they can do all the time then there is a deeper issue or health problem.

A LD spouse can also help the issue by resolving to take advantage of the situations where they are feeling up to enthusiastic sex and making it a point to initiate.
Happily married to Serafina for 7 years. She is my Venus. ::luv2
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LBD
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Re: Compare & contrasting list of "healthy vs unhealthy" sex

Post by LBD »

NWNL- you like the list, that’s obvious. You ask what “stood out.” It stands out as a restrictive two choice list: this column good, this column bad. It seems to want to characterize sex as either healthy (according to their list) or abusive/addictive. I honestly think if the list had been presented by someone else, you would be one of the first to say it is too restrictive and doesn’t leave enough room for nuance or variations along the spectrum of realities.


But that’s just my opinion….which you asked for. I don’t like it. You’re free to disagree. :D
It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell
::dog
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